WesWorld

This will hopefully make the bulk of Australia's Destroyer force. Thoughts, Comments?

DD-1, Australia Destroyer laid down 1928

Displacement:
1,534 t light; 1,595 t standard; 1,783 t normal; 1,933 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
327.19 ft / 325.00 ft x 32.00 ft x 12.00 ft (normal load)
99.73 m / 99.06 m x 9.75 m x 3.66 m

Armament:
5 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.58lbs / 23.85kg shells, 1929 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1929 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline, all amidships
20 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (10x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1929 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 283 lbs / 129 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
8 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.20" / 30 mm - -

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 42,138 shp / 31,435 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 10,500nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 338 tons

Complement:
136 - 178

Cost:
£0.864 million / $3.456 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 35 tons, 2.0 %
Armour: 16 tons, 0.9 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 16 tons, 0.9 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 947 tons, 53.1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 526 tons, 29.5 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 249 tons, 13.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 0.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
456 lbs / 207 Kg = 8.7 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.21
Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 11.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.36
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.07

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.500
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.16 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 20.55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 73 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 67
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.00 ft / 7.62 m
- Forecastle (30 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m (15.00 ft / 4.57 m aft of break)
- Mid (50 %): 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Stern: 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Average freeboard: 17.28 ft / 5.27 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 187.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 71.1 %
Waterplane Area: 7,206 Square feet or 669 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 62 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 32 lbs/sq ft or 155 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.49
- Longitudinal: 3.75
- Overall: 0.60
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Normally I'd say shes heavy on the AA but this is Wesworld so thats not really an abnormality.

You could likely increase her number of rounds per main gun as high as you can (250?) before her hull strength dips below 0.50. She has an outstandign range, that may be the only thing thats pushing boundary's. I'm taking a guess that her current range translates to around 5200 nm @15 knots which is better than the British "B" class destroyers laid down the same year historically.

I like the design.

Five things to say about the design:
- Cross-sectional at 0.49
- Perhaps main guns with hoists
- Like Wes said, more main gun shells.

Wesworld or not, I think there's a bit too much flak right now. Other issues aside, it looks good, though I'm not so convinced that fifth gun really accomplishes much.

Updated version. Increased range & shells. Added hoist. Dropped 10 20mm.

DD-1, Australia Destroyer laid down 1929

Displacement:
1,541 t light; 1,617 t standard; 1,865 t normal; 2,063 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
342.19 ft / 340.00 ft x 32.00 ft x 12.00 ft (normal load)
104.30 m / 103.63 m x 9.75 m x 3.66 m

Armament:
5 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.58lbs / 23.85kg shells, 1929 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1929 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline, all amidships
10 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns in single mounts, 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1929 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 281 lbs / 127 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 240
8 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.20" / 30 mm - -

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 42,128 shp / 31,428 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 5,500nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 446 tons

Complement:
141 - 184

Cost:
£0.884 million / $3.535 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 35 tons, 1.9 %
Armour: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 982 tons, 52.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 498 tons, 26.7 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 324 tons, 17.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 0.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
405 lbs / 184 Kg = 7.7 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.20
Metacentric height 1.3 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 12.0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.70
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.09

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.500
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.63 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 20.95 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 71 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 65
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.00 ft / 7.62 m
- Forecastle (30 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m (15.00 ft / 4.57 m aft of break)
- Mid (50 %): 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Stern: 15.00 ft / 4.57 m
- Average freeboard: 17.28 ft / 5.27 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 185.8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 75.4 %
Waterplane Area: 7,538 Square feet or 700 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 64 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 29 lbs/sq ft or 140 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.41
- Longitudinal: 2.80
- Overall: 0.50
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

While the usefulness of the fifth gun can be debated, it was historically used on many vessels.

Do the English use a 20mm or 40mm gun at this time?

While I've not located a British 20mm, I've located a Vickers 4cm/39 2 pounder that can work. The Mark II or IIC would be in operation historically in this time, and the Mark VII would be introduced in 1930. So it is reasonable to have the Mark VII (or an intermediate model) a year early on an Australian design.

But the machine guns would probably be Vickers (or Browning) 0.5 inch MG or .303 inch Maxim MG

2 pounder pompoms (listed as having 40mm caliber on Navweaps). Not sure about the 20mm.
Japan uses the 2 pounder as well.

Quoted

- Cross-sectional: 0.41
- Longitudinal: 2.80
- Overall: 0.50

Cross-sectional should be 0.50

Quoted

- Cross-sectional: 0.41
- Longitudinal: 2.80
- Overall: 0.50

Cross-sectional should be 0.50

So how do I fix that?

Quoted

Do the English use a 20mm or 40mm gun at this time?

From the Brithish Improved E

Quoted

8 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1923 Model
8 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1923 Model

Looks like their using them. I can always change to twin 50 cal.

Hmmm. It seems we missed something.

(D-class in 1936 had the following according to Jane's:

6 six inch
3 four inch AA
4 three pounders
2 two pounder pom-pom
2 Machine Guns
8 Lewis guns
12 twenty-one inch above water torpedo tubes in 4 triple mounts.)

Quoted

Hmmmm, I wonder where those 40mm and 20mm came from?

My guess would be "Bofors" and "Oerlikon". :-)
Like I said: 40mm = 2pdr, but I think it should be slightly adjusted with shell weight.
Best guess for a 20mm would be the 20 mm Hispano-Suiza in the Netherlands section of Navweaps's gun section which was on "Most Ships 1930s"

Quoted

So how do I fix that?

Make it slower, less range, less guns alter dimensions to get a slightly deeper draught, or lower freeboard if you can live with a poor seaboat rating.

Being a destroyer, a low seaboat rating is usually a given. The historical "B" class DD's built the same year as these ships mounted 40mm guns, though not as many.

As for the 20mm, the Aussies could always shop arround for whatever the Brits can't spare.

The design has a block coefficient of .5, whereas ~.4 to .42 might be more the norm. Drop that down, increase the beam a bit, and she should be just as fast but gaining hull strength.

Further revision. Still have to work on the cross sectional strenght.

DD-1, Australia Destroyer laid down 1928

Displacement:
1,594 t light; 1,676 t standard; 2,005 t normal; 2,268 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
372.10 ft / 370.00 ft x 35.00 ft x 12.90 ft (normal load)
113.42 m / 112.78 m x 10.67 m x 3.93 m

Armament:
5 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.58lbs / 23.85kg shells, 1928 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.89kg shells, 1928 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline, all amidships
20 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (10x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1928 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 283 lbs / 129 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 250
8 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.20" / 30 mm - -

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 35,219 shp / 26,273 Kw = 33.00 kts
Range 7,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 592 tons

Complement:
149 - 194

Cost:
£0.840 million / $3.360 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 35 tons, 1.8 %
Armour: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 960 tons, 47.9 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 573 tons, 28.6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 410 tons, 20.5 %
Miscellaneous weights: 10 tons, 0.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
600 lbs / 272 Kg = 11.4 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.35
Metacentric height 1.8 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 11.1 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.43
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.25

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.420
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.57 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.08 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 65 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 56
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Forecastle (30 %): 20.00 ft / 6.10 m (14.00 ft / 4.27 m aft of break)
- Mid (50 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Stern: 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 16.28 ft / 4.96 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 169.8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 86.2 %
Waterplane Area: 8,381 Square feet or 779 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 80 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 33 lbs/sq ft or 162 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.48
- Longitudinal: 2.04
- Overall: 0.56
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Yeah, but you're close. Unless you're heart-set on "Good seakeeping", drop your freeboard by about a foot and see what you get.

Final Design (hopefully). Dropped some range. Id rather keep the seekeeping, to even up the odds against faster DDs.

DD-1, Australia Destroyer laid down 1928

Displacement:
1,546 t light; 1,625 t standard; 1,895 t normal; 2,111 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
371.92 ft / 370.00 ft x 35.00 ft x 12.90 ft (normal load)
113.36 m / 112.78 m x 10.67 m x 3.93 m

Armament:
5 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns in single mounts, 52.58lbs / 23.85kg shells, 1928 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.95lbs / 0.88kg shells, 1928 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline, all amidships
20 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (10x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1928 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 283 lbs / 129 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 250
8 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.20" / 30 mm - -

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 33,454 shp / 24,957 Kw = 33.00 kts
Range 5,900nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 485 tons

Complement:
143 - 186

Cost:
£0.801 million / $3.203 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 35 tons, 1.9 %
Armour: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 16 tons, 0.8 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 899 tons, 47.4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 576 tons, 30.4 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 349 tons, 18.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 1.1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
590 lbs / 268 Kg = 11.2 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.31
Metacentric height 1.7 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 11.3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.45
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.24

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.397
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.57 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.16 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 64 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 56
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 21.90 ft / 6.68 m
- Forecastle (30 %): 19.00 ft / 5.79 m (14.00 ft / 4.27 m aft of break)
- Mid (50 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Stern: 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 15.85 ft / 4.83 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 169.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 88.4 %
Waterplane Area: 8,259 Square feet or 767 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 79 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 34 lbs/sq ft or 168 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.50
- Longitudinal: 2.02
- Overall: 0.57
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Looks good to me.

Good firepower, and excellent stability, seakeeping, and range for a DD.

My only quibble would be all those 20mm guns vs. available deck space.