Dear visitor, welcome to WesWorld. If this is your first visit here, please read the Help. It explains in detail how this page works. To use all features of this page, you should consider registering. Please use the registration form, to register here or read more information about the registration process. If you are already registered, please login here.
Quoted
Originally posted by The Rock Doctor
Naval construction capacity in the sim in 1942 is still directly linked to the pre-1920 naval programs we used as a basis for set-up. The only way to improve on this has been:
1) Invest existing production in new factories - a process which takes 20 years to pay for itself and which is particularly challenging for smaller and medium powers.
2) Put the case forward for unique upgrades, such as Canada when it became PC, and Germany after the Treaty of Versailles ended.
I'd like to float the idea of tweaking factory counts for countries to account for industrialization of populations - especially large populations - over the past twenty years of sim-time.
I think this would have a couple of beneficial results:
A) Those of us playing smaller and medium countries won't suffer too badly as warship sizes escalate in the post-treaty environment and treaty-era stuff begin to require modernization. We can continue to design and build cruisers and the occasional capital ship.
B) Those of us playing larger powers will continue to have credible rivals in places like South America and Asia - and thus genuine reasons to have these large fleets in the first place.
Thoughts?
Quoted
Originally posted by Brockpaine
Personally, I think that would unfairly advantage countries with extremely large populations, such as India and China, within the context of the game. There are a few issues I have with the current system, yes; but I don't really see that it's "broken" enough to merit radical change. Still, the idea might have some merit for whenever we finish up this sim and move on to Wesworld-2.
Quoted
Originally posted by The Rock Doctor
B) Those of us playing larger powers will continue to have credible rivals in places like South America and Asia - and thus genuine reasons to have these large fleets in the first place.
This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "parador" (Sep 26th 2012, 12:59pm)
Quoted
Why do you think there is an unfairly advantage ??? You are surely right, if it directly depends on the populations. But we could include a factor that makes it more "harmonized".
Quoted
For example why there is a need for germany to build 4 BB's which are at the same size of the OTL H-Class (Z-Plan) when there is no enemy ? Gemany is surrounded by european friends. And no war is growing on the horizont. (don't take it personally Bruce, it's only a question, i have no problems with the way you play germany - on the contrary i like it !!!!!). With a rule, depending on the population, other countries are stronger and so there is may be a need for huge fleets.
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
How do you create a rule to 'harmonize' the differences between a nation with a population of 50 million with one of 400 million. I'd like to see such a concrete proposal.
Quoted
Originally posted by parador
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
How do you create a rule to 'harmonize' the differences between a nation with a population of 50 million with one of 400 million. I'd like to see such a concrete proposal.
Do we have an overview about the population of each country ? Without having this overview it's hard do make a proposal.
A first, unproven shot could be for every 100 million people a country gets an additional factory.
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
That is the problem; the population of many nations is not documentable; too many nations have presumed that they could deflect the stream of emigrants in the 19th Century to their shores - so much so that Europe might have been emptied as people. And in defining populations, do you only count the population in the homeland - where the industry is - or the colonial empires, where the bulk of the population might lie.
An additional factory per every 100 million population would benefit very few countries.
I do not see any benefit from a rules change at this time.
Quoted
Originally posted by parador
With the existing rule also only a few countries have benefited.
Quoted
Rocky asked about countries with especially large populations. In my eyes at present there are only a few countries which meet this requirements. So also only a few countries will get this benefit. If we want to change the rule so that all or many countries get the benefit, the bonus will grow to another dimension. Then I have to agree with Brock, then it will be unbalanced (huge bonus for countries with huge population). And I do not think it was Rocky's intention, to get a big bonus. I think he just wanted that the present population plays a role and not ships built at the beginning of the century.
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
But we all knew those conditions, for better or worse, when we entered the game. We are now talking about a potentially game-unbalancing change.
Quoted
We have a mechanism in the rules that allows factories to be built, which many nations have availed themselves of. That some prefer to invest in their fleets and not in their industries is a player choice.
Quoted
Are the costs to build a factory too high? Perhaps in retrospect they are. Should they be changed now? I would reserve comment until I saw an actual proposal for a rules change. Should they be reconsidered when the rules for Wesworld Two are framed? Most certainly.
Quoted
Again, NO . We didn't talk about a potentially game-unbalancing change !!! With the proposal (1factory per 100mio), where is there a unbalancing change ?
Quoted
By the way, if we add (up to 100mio = 1 factory), so every nation gets a bonus.
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
A rule that impacts only one or two countries is by definition unbalanced.
This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "parador" (Sep 26th 2012, 3:38pm)
Quoted
Originally posted by parador
Quoted
By the way, if we add (up to 100mio = 1 factory), so every nation gets a bonus.
If you make a qoute please make it complete
Quoted
Originally posted by BruceDuncan
The last seven or so years of the game's life is not the time to make these fundamental changes to our rules, particulalrly when their benefit is skewed so much in favor of one or two nations.
Quoted
"Starting in 19__, countries get 0.1 IP per year per hundred million population to invest in a new factory or infrastructure."
Forum Software: Burning Board® Lite 2.1.2 pl 1, developed by WoltLab® GmbH