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41

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 12:32am

K.D.M. Vaerge (Guardian)

[IMG]http://<img src="http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v91/CommodoreGreen/K.gif">[/IMG]

42

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 12:33am

[IMG]http://<img src="http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v91/CommodoreGreen/Guardian_colour_schemes.gif">[/IMG]

43

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 12:38am

And her details.......

KDM Vaerge (Guardian), Denmark Cruiser laid down 1914

Displacement:
7,647 t light; 7,933 t standard; 9,352 t normal; 10,449 t full load
Loading submergence 643 tons/feet

Dimensions:
555.00 ft x 66.00 ft x 18.50 ft (normal load)
169.16 m x 20.12 m x 5.64 m

Armament:
4 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns (2 Main turrets x 2 guns)
6 - 6.00" / 152 mm guns
8 - 3.00" / 76 mm AA guns
16 - 0.51" / 13 mm guns
Weight of broadside 1,189 lbs / 539 kg
4 - 18.0" / 457.2 mm above water torpedoes
4 - 18.0" / 457.2 mm submerged torpedoes
Armour:
Belt 3.00" / 76 mm, upper belt 1.75" / 44 mm, end belts 1.25" / 32 mm
Belts cover 102 % of normal area
Main turrets 1.50" / 38 mm, 2nd gun shields 1.00" / 25 mm
Armour deck 1.18" / 30 mm, Conning tower 3.50" / 89 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 3 shafts, 65,306 shp / 48,718 Kw = 30.00 kts
Range 13,500nm at 12.00 kts

Complement:
475 - 618

Cost:
£0.948 million / $3.791 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 149 tons, 1.6 %
Armour: 1,350 tons, 14.4 %
Belts: 754 tons, 8.1 %, Armament: 72 tons, 0.8 %, Armour Deck: 491 tons, 5.3 %
Conning Tower: 33 tons, 0.4 %, Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 2,516 tons, 26.9 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,532 tons, 37.8 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,705 tons, 18.2 %
Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 1.1 %

Metacentric height 4.4

Remarks:
Hull space for machinery, storage & compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation & workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Estimated overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Relative margin of stability: 1.32
Shellfire needed to sink: 12,504 lbs / 5,672 Kg = 115.8 x 6.0 " / 152 mm shells
(Approx weight of penetrating shell hits needed to sink ship excluding critical hits)
Torpedoes needed to sink: 1.6
(Approx number of typical torpedo hits needed to sink ship)
Relative steadiness as gun platform: 71 %
(Average = 50 %)
Relative rocking effect from firing to beam: 0.22
Relative quality as seaboat: 1.22

Hull form characteristics:
Block coefficient: 0.483
Sharpness coefficient: 0.34
Hull speed coefficient 'M': 8.06
'Natural speed' for length: 23.56 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
Trim: 58
(Maximise stabilty/flotation = 0, Maximise steadiness/seakeeping = 100)

Estimated hull characteristics & strength:
Underwater volume absorbed by magazines and engineering spaces: 101.1 %
Relative accommodation and working space: 140.5 %
(Average = 100%)
Displacement factor: 122 %
(Displacement relative to loading factors)
Relative cross-sectional hull strength: 0.96
(Structure weight / hull surface area: 99 lbs / square foot or 484 Kg / square metre)
Relative longitudinal hull strength: 1.44
(for 20.00 ft / 6.10 m average freeboard, freeboard adjustment 5.06 ft)
Relative composite hull strength: 1.00

The 3 Guardian class cruisers, "Guardian", "Protector", & " Defender",
are part of the Emergency Building Programme of the Danish Navy in 1914,
to bolster the ability of the Navy to undertake the maritime security of the Danish Protectorates,
and are designed to patrol the Danish Protectorates in the Far East and Africa.
As a result these vessels often take on the role of floating embassies for the Danish Crown.
Their primary duties are the protection of the merchant marine, and the overseas Protectorates.
They are built for long range and high speed, with a degree of comfort for any diplomats aboard.

44

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 1:19am

Much beter than the original designs except for a few things. Her light AA is quite numerous for a ship laid down in 1914 and those funnel caps also look too modern. I also think your after CT would site right at the end of your uper deck just ahead of the after 6" twin. By and large though shes significantly better than the first design. I somehow get the impression she now may be TOO long, are you useing a scale to draw your ships? I'm trying not to be overly critical but in 1914 ships were fairly basic compaired to 1918 designs, but again your miles ahead on this design in reguards to the preveious one, good work!

45

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 6:58am

yes, looks much more realistic :-)

2 things:
- where are the torps?
- camo paint in WW I?

cheers Bernhard

HoOmAn

Keeper of the Sacred Block Coefficient

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46

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 9:04am

Suggestions

Hi CG,

she now looks really good.

Few suggestions/proposals:

- enlarge her rangefinders - at least I assume those things atop the bridge and aft superstructure to be rangefinders

- enlarge those boats - they look silly

- declare those picture to resemble her looks after a major rebuild in the 1920s - she looks way too modern for a 1914er design. In fact she´s somewhat similar to the early italian or british (COUNTY-class) cruisers.

- declare those camo-pics to show her as of ~1935 - camouflage like that was unknown until ~WW2 in the real world...

- to make her look as of 1914 give her four funnels, two for each of the funnels you have now and without caps, remove the rangefinders (not available in 1914), remove/rearrange the torpedos (multiple deck torpodes the way you draw them were a feature of 1920er cruiser designs), maybe re-shape her bow to make it look "old school" (ram bow), maybe (!) remove the turrets for and aft and replace them by two single guns abreast of each other as on the german cruisers (should not be necessaary - ACs of that era already featured double turrets fore and aft) and maybe rearrange the forward superstructure. All this should make her look much more like a pre-WW1-design - maybe like a small AC what would fit her specs.

- the single gun shields are too long


Well, I think she´s a fine ship - her look just doesn´t fit her era. So either use that picture for a cruiser class you´ll lay down in the 1920s or do as proposed above: declare those cruisers to be heavily modified in the 1920s.

Anyway, keep ´em coming,

HoOmAn

47

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 10:18am

Nice work!

Interesting design, and excellent drawing!

48

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 1:56pm

about that facelift!!!

well she went under the knife (cutting torch) again.....
<img src="http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v91/CommodoreGreen/KDMVaerge.gif">

HoOmAn

Keeper of the Sacred Block Coefficient

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49

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:01pm

Aargh!

ArgH!

Now you´ve messed around with your pictures and we can´t see the older versions of your picture any longer! Thus there´s no way to compare them. You´ve also deleted the colored picture... (scroll up this thread!)

Could you please put it online again?

Further more I still wonder why you store so many kayaks on deck of your cruiser......?!

Regards,

HoOmAn

50

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:04pm

They are still there!

51

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:06pm

sorry!!!!

will fix!

52

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:15pm

Here's hoping!!

The last face lift!

<img src="http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v91/CommodoreGreen/Guardian.gif">

And the colour schemes!

<img src="http://img30.photobucket.com/albums/v91/CommodoreGreen/Vaerge_colour.gif">

53

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:19pm

As to the ships boats (and she seems to be breeding them!), she is carrying 2 X 35' Launches, 11 X 20 motor boats, and 8 X 16' rowing boats!

No kayaks, although the first officer has a surf-board from the last trip across the Pacific!!

HoOmAn

Keeper of the Sacred Block Coefficient

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54

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 2:45pm

That one...

That one should have been around when TITANIC sank...

However, I also wonder why her midship turrets point in different directions....?!

Regards,

HoOmAn

PS: Are you using MS Paint for that stuff?

55

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 3:03pm

Turrets...no specific reason!

Microserf Paint...yes!

That one...?...got it (groan)

56

Tuesday, March 2nd 2004, 11:03pm

Now she looks much better, all she needs is very minor tweaks like the apearance of the rangefinders, forward spoting position and most of all those boats!
Your 1 pixle=1 foot scale makes her look really odd but would be very accurate.

57

Wednesday, March 3rd 2004, 1:34am

odd in what way?

And what, pray tell, is the issue with the boats.......
surely 8 x 16' boats, 11 X 20' motor boats and 2 x 35' launches are sufficient?

58

Wednesday, March 3rd 2004, 1:41am

With the scale you use it gives the impression of a great length for the hull. This also shows in the lifeboats too. While being to the same scale they look tiny compaired to the hull. Reguardless we still get the idea of what she looks like.

59

Saturday, March 6th 2004, 2:40pm

Interesting drawing.

I've just put a drawing into my design of the Admiral Lazarev class light cruisers.


http://admkuznetsov.tripod.com/fantasy_fleets/id31.html

They were laid down in 1914, but weren't completed by the time Nicholas II abdicated. They were redesigned, 4 15cm in dual turrets and 8 15cm in main deck casemates replacing the original 15 13cm main armament.

60

Saturday, March 6th 2004, 10:05pm

Very impressive cut and past job there Stuart! Shes quite a looker, beter than the historical russian designs for sure.