WesWorld

Archer Class (build), Denmark DD (aa) laid down 1932

Displacement:
1,985 t light; 2,061 t standard; 2,370 t normal; 2,617 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
390.51 ft / 370.00 ft x 35.00 ft x 15.00 ft (normal load)
119.03 m / 112.78 m x 10.67 m x 4.57 m

Armament:
4 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (2x2 guns), 52.72lbs / 23.91kg shells, 1930 Model
Dual purpose guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline, all forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
8 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1928 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline, all aft, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1925 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 331 lbs / 150 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 225
8 - 21.0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.97" / 50 mm 0.79" / 20 mm 0.98" / 25 mm
2nd: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.79" / 20 mm -
3rd: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.79" / 20 mm -

- Conning tower: 0.79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 44,581 shp / 33,257 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 556 tons

Complement:
169 - 220

Cost:
£1.200 million / $4.801 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 41 tons, 1.7 %
Armour: 50 tons, 2.1 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 47 tons, 2.0 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 3 tons, 0.1 %
Machinery: 1,142 tons, 48.2 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 662 tons, 27.9 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 385 tons, 16.2 %
Miscellaneous weights: 90 tons, 3.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
572 lbs / 260 Kg = 10.9 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
Metacentric height 1.2 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 13.5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.61
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.427
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.57 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.06 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 67 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 69
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 35.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 3.00 ft / 0.91 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.00 ft / 7.62 m
- Forecastle (25 %): 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Mid (40 %): 20.00 ft / 6.10 m (12.00 ft / 3.66 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
- Stern: 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
- Average freeboard: 15.93 ft / 4.85 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 173.1 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 77.1 %
Waterplane Area: 8,425 Square feet or 783 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 76 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 38 lbs/sq ft or 183 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.50
- Longitudinal: 2.10
- Overall: 0.57
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Archer class fleet escort vessels were specifically designed to use the 120mm turrets designed for the "Dido-kyrie" class AA CLs and retrofitted to the "Hel" class CAs. They are to supplement the anti-aircraft capabilities of the fleet, while still carrying out the normal duties of a fleet DD. Turrets simmed as triples to simulate increased weight of HA/LA Auto loading mounts, twins actually mounted.

While she is designed with a high misc weight I think there are several other 2000ts designs in WesWorld that are much better. Featuring double turrets on barbets costs you a lot. Wouldn´t it be better to use deckmounts (probably with hoists) instead? How good is a DD as an anti-aircraft platform?

Back to the drawing board.....

pay the additional weight of the triple mounts as misc weight, but sim her as having twins, because I noticed that the RECOIL is drastically affected? If so, how does this grab you, HA/LA mounts with hoists instead of turrets....

Archer Class (build III), Denmark DD (aa) laid down 1932

Displacement:
1,956 t light; 2,040 t standard; 2,350 t normal; 2,598 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
392.81 ft / 373.00 ft x 35.00 ft x 15.50 ft (normal load)
119.73 m / 113.69 m x 10.67 m x 4.72 m

Armament:
8 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (4x2 guns), 52.72lbs / 23.91kg shells, 1930 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
6 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (2x3 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1928 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1925 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 433 lbs / 196 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
4 - 21.0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.97" / 50 mm 0.79" / 20 mm -
2nd: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.79" / 20 mm -
3rd: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.79" / 20 mm -

- Conning tower: 0.79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 43,574 shp / 32,506 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 558 tons

Complement:
168 - 219

Cost:
£1.222 million / $4.887 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 54 tons, 2.3 %
Armour: 38 tons, 1.6 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 35 tons, 1.5 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 3 tons, 0.1 %
Machinery: 1,106 tons, 47.1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 678 tons, 28.9 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 394 tons, 16.7 %
Miscellaneous weights: 80 tons, 3.4 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
585 lbs / 265 Kg = 11.1 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.09
Metacentric height 1.2 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 13.3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.81
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.01

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.406
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.66 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.20 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 66 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 69
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 35.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 3.00 ft / 0.91 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 24.00 ft / 7.32 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 20.00 ft / 6.10 m
- Mid (40 %): 20.00 ft / 6.10 m (12.00 ft / 3.66 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
- Stern: 12.00 ft / 3.66 m
- Average freeboard: 15.52 ft / 4.73 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 173.3 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 108.3 %
Waterplane Area: 8,373 Square feet or 778 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 75 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 39 lbs/sq ft or 191 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.51
- Longitudinal: 1.99
- Overall: 0.58
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

50 DC's carried

That's certainly an improvement.

I guess it´s a matter of taste. You traded 4 TTs for four more guns. However, if this DD really is meant to be an AAA platform then those guns surely are an improvement. I´ve heard pilots are not that much impressed by torpedos fired at them - well, except one Japanese probably... :o)

When I draw it I may get the 4 torps back on, we'll just have to wait and see......

Should be no problem knowing that this one has 3x4 tubes and fairly similar main armament on a hull that is about as long as your Archer (116.13 meters o.a. vs Archer 's 119.03 meters).

Did the Somers have turrets or gunhouses?

Turrets. SP, tho. They required major work to refit them with the later DP 5" turrets during the war

Quoted

I´ve heard pilots are not that much impressed by torpedos fired at them - well, except one Japanese probably... :o)

Indeed. He might mistake it for sushi, with the result being a rather different kind of "explosive" stomach problems. ^_^

Archer Class (build4), Denmark DD (aa) laid down 1932

Displacement:
1,956 t light; 2,041 t standard; 2,348 t normal; 2,594 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
405.97 ft / 390.00 ft x 39.00 ft x 14.00 ft (normal load)
123.74 m / 118.87 m x 11.89 m x 4.27 m

Armament:
8 - 4.72" / 120 mm guns (4x2 guns), 52.72lbs / 23.91kg shells, 1930 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
10 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (5x2 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1928 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships, 4 raised mounts - superfiring
12 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm guns (6x2 guns), 0.24lbs / 0.11kg shells, 1925 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, 4 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 440 lbs / 200 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
8 - 21.0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.59" / 15 mm -
2nd: 0.59" / 15 mm 0.59" / 15 mm -
3rd: 0.59" / 15 mm 0.59" / 15 mm -

- Conning tower: 0.79" / 20 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric motors, 2 shafts, 41,921 shp / 31,273 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 553 tons

Complement:
168 - 219

Cost:
£1.210 million / $4.839 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 55 tons, 2.3 %
Armour: 29 tons, 1.2 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 26 tons, 1.1 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 3 tons, 0.1 %
Machinery: 1,082 tons, 46.1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 710 tons, 30.2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 392 tons, 16.7 %
Miscellaneous weights: 80 tons, 3.4 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
691 lbs / 313 Kg = 13.1 x 4.7 " / 120 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.17
Metacentric height 1.6 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 12.9 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.59
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.386
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.90 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 65 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 69
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 30.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 5.00 ft / 1.52 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 19.00 ft / 5.79 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 17.00 ft / 5.18 m
- Mid (50 %): 15.50 ft / 4.72 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 14.50 ft / 4.42 m
- Stern: 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 15.82 ft / 4.82 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 170.5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 108.7 %
Waterplane Area: 9,646 Square feet or 896 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 78 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 40 lbs/sq ft or 195 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.50
- Longitudinal: 1.64
- Overall: 0.56
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

I think that's your best drawing yet, Mac. Nice attention to detail. It's also a well-balanced approach to the big DD.

Excellent drawing Mac.

I think it might be best to ditch the aft director in favour of 2 more 37mm mountings.

Probably overly-long racks of depth charges aft on the fantail.

Thanks guys!

She is a developement of my existing "Raptor" class DD's, same hull, a knot slower to allow for extra magazine space, very similar look to cause recogonition issues to enemy spotters, fewer depth charges (not primary role) also to save weight to allow for HA/LA mounts, as for the second director, it would allow the mains to engage seperate targets simultaneously.

does it make sense?

I'd say instead of a second director for the 120mm guns you could mount one for the 37mm. It would be smaller (less weight) and boost your overall targeting.

Few nitpicks, as Gavin said the DP racks look large while the lifeboats look a wee bit small. Perhaps two larger boats and some light rafts in exchange for the 4 smaller ones.

Other than that a nice balanced design.