WesWorld

Not a Japanese vessel, but built by Japanese yards...


Argentine Submarine Salta (design as built)
Date: 1947
Type: Oceanic
Length: 79.0m
Beam: 7.3m
Draft: 8.1m
Crush depth: 317.5m
Light Displacement 1666t
Loaded Displacement 2104t
Full Displacement 2336t
wt fuel&batts: 620t
Reserve buoyancy: 10%

Armament:
- 6 x 533mm (bow)
- 2x 20mm Machineguns (1 from sim, 1 from misc weights)
- 48 tons for mines or reload torpedoes
ElecHP: 3800hp
DieselHP: 7200hp
Speed:
- Max Surf Speed: 18.1 knots
- Max Sub Speed: 14.5 knots
Range:
- Surfaced: 16,159nm@10 knots
- Submerged: 231nm@5 knots
Tons Oil: 390.0t
Tons Battery: 230.0t
Miscellaneous Weight: 130 tons

Crew: 70


- 24x 533 mm torpedo reloads (= 48 tons for mines or reload torpedoes)
- Main electric engines output: 3,600 shp.
- Silent running engines output: 200 shp.
- Actual submerged speed: (silent running electric engines) 5.4 knots, (main electric engines) 14.2 knots
- 130 tons Miscellaneous weights breakdown:


--- 23 tons for electric torpedo reloading system
--- 10 tons for Ninjatousaya System
--- 50 tons for sonar, hydrophones and radar
--- 17 tons for air condition system
--- 17 tons for damage control and fire suppression systems
--- 2 tons for deep freeze unit
--- 1 tons for extra 20mm MG
--- 5 tons for desalinization gear
--- 5 tons for various

Changes by the Japanese to the original submitted design (free of charge):
- Damage control and fire suppression systems added.
- Desalinization gear added.
- Storage for 6 extra torpedoes in the torpedo room.
- Addition of 200 hp silent running electric engines.
- 1375 nm extra range while surfaced.

I-314 Submarine
Experimental submarine along the lines of the French Gymnote class and Italian V-Class. The I-314 is equipped with a H2O2 propulsion system using a high-concentration solution of hydrogen peroxide.

Date: 1947
Type: Coastal
Length: 56.0m
Beam: 5.0m
Draft: 5.5m
Crush depth: 225.0m
Light Displacement 571t
Loaded Displacement 692t
Full Displacement 770t
wt fuel&batts: 115t
Reserve buoyancy: 10%

Armament:
- 4 x 533mm (bow)
- 16 tons for mines or reload torpedoes
ElecHP: 80hp
DieselHP: 500hp
H2O2HP: 9500hp
Speed:
- Max Surf Speed: 10.2 knots
- Max Sub Speed: 25.6 knots
Range:
- Surfaced: 3,564nm@10 knots
- Submerged: 3,198nm@5 knots
Tons Oil: 40.0t
Tons Battery: 10.0t
Tons H2O2: 65.0t
Miscellaneous Weight: 110 tons

Crew: 34

- 12 Type 3 torpedoes (= 4 in the tubes + 8 from the 16 tons for 'mines or reload torpedoes')
- Diesel + H2O2 drive + silent running electric engine.
- Surface speed: (diesel) 10.2 knots, (H2O2) 26.3 knots.
- Submerged speed: (silent running engines) 5.1 knots, (H2O2) 25.5 knots, (diesel + Ninjatousaya) 9.5 knots.
- Range Surfaced (diesel): 4,400nm@9 knots, 3,564nm@10 knots.
- Range Submerged (silent running engines): 134nm@2 knots, 53nm@3 knots, 12nm@5 knots.
- Range Submerged (H2O2): 3,186nm@5 knots, 1,245nm@8 knots, 796nm@10 knots, 354nm@15 knots, 127nm@25 knots.
- Range Submerged (diesel + Ninjatousaya): 4,050nm@6 knots, 2,120nm@8 knots, 1,300@9.5 knots.
- Endurance: (surfaced, diesel) 14 days and 20 hours @ 10 knots, (submerged, H2O2) 26 days and 13 hours @ 5 knots.
- Diving depth: 295 feet
- Emergency Depth: 472 feet
- Crush Depth: 738 feet
- 110 tons Miscellaneous weights breakdown:
--- 10 tons for Ninjatousaya System
--- 30 tons for sonar and hydrophones
--- 10 tons for air condition system
--- 2 tons for 40 oxygen bottles (50 l, 150 atm)
--- 5 tons CO2 removal system + Soda lime
--- 40 tons for damage control and fire suppression systems
--- 6 tons for demagnetization cables
--- 2 tons for deep freeze unit
--- 5 tons for desalinization gear

I-315 Submarine
Continuation of the evolution of the I-305 design. The I-315 class is bigger and more powerful than the I-310 class, being similar in size to the I-400 and I-402 classes. The I-315 was designed for the purpose of attacking and sinking other submarines, surface combatants and merchant vessels and it is the first patrol submarine of the Imperial Japanese Navy that does not carry any kind of defensive or offensive guns, relying solely on its torpedoes and ability to remain submerged for long periods of time.

Date: 1947
Type: Oceanic
Length: 130.0m
Beam: 11.2m
Draft: 12.0m
Crush depth: 317.5m
Light Displacement 6591t
Loaded Displacement 7896t
Full Displacement 8736t
wt fuel&batts: 3050t
Reserve buoyancy: 10%

Armament:
- 8 x 533mm (bow)
- 80 tons for mines or reload torpedoes
ElecHP: 36000hp
DieselHP: 11500hp
Speed:
- Max Surf Speed: 16.1 knots
- Max Sub Speed: 22.8 knots
Range:
- Surfaced: 22,311nm@10 knots
- Submerged: 800nm@5 knots
Tons Oil: 1225.0t
Tons Battery: 1825.0t
Miscellaneous Weight: 700 tons

Crew: 193

- 48 Type 3 torpedoes (= 8 in the tubes + 40 from the 80 tons for 'mines or reload torpedoes', 20 in the upper room and 20 in the lower room), 8 idle positions to permit withdrawal of torpedoes from tubes for servicing (16 tons miscellaneous).
- Diesel-electric drive.
- Main electric engines output: 35,000 shp.
- Silent running engines output: 1,000 shp.
- Surface speed: (diesel-electric) 16.1 knots, (battery-electric) 23.4 knots.
- Submerged speed: (silent running engines) 6.9 knots, (battery-electric) 22.6 knots, (diesel-electric + Ninjatousaya) 12 knots.
- Range Surfaced (diesel-Electric): 27,569nm@9 knots, 22,331nm@10 knots, 15,570nm@12 knots, 9,925nm@15 knots.
- Range Submerged (batteries, silent running engines): 2,264nm@3 knots, 800nm@5 knots, 547nm@6 knots.
- Range Submerged (batteries, main engines): 292nm@8 knots, 172nm@10 knots, 56nm@15 knots.
- Range Submerged (diesel-electric + Ninjatousaya): 27,150nm@6 knots, 15,050nm@8 knots, 9,450@10 knots, 8,400nm@12 knots.
- Endurance: (surfaced, diesel) 92 days and 23 hours @ 10 knots, (submerged, batteries) 6 days and 16 hours @ 5 knots.
- Diving depth: 417 feet
- Emergency Depth: 667 feet
- Crush Depth: 1042 feet
- 700 tons Miscellaneous weights breakdown:
--- 30 tons for electric torpedo reloading system.
--- 20 tons for air-powered piston ejection pumps.
--- 5 tons for torpedo service material.
--- 16 tons for 8 idle torpedo positions in the torpedo rooms (4 upper, 4 lower) for torpedo servicing.
--- 10 tons for Ninjatousaya System.
--- 100 tons for sonar+, hydrophones, air search radar, air/surface radar and radar warning receiver.
--- 200 tons for defense countermeasures, 'camouflage' and sound-isolation.
--- 66 tons for air condition system.
--- 15 tons for 300 oxygen bottles (50 l, 150 atm).
--- 10 tons for CO2 removal system + Soda lime.
--- 66 tons for damage control and fire suppression systems.
--- 20 tons for demagnetization cables.
--- 15 tons for safety and rescue equipment.
--- 15 tons for yatai mobile food stall.
--- 20 tons for pachinko parlor.
--- 15 tons for karaoke facilities + Kobe Cola vending machines.
--- 20 tons for officer's lounge.
--- 10 tons for deep freeze unit.
--- 5 tons for desalinization gear.
--- 32 tons for crew comforts (toilets, showers, board games, puzzles, playing cards, dice games, etc.)
--- 10 tons for improved control surfaces.

I still haven't decided what to think of that.

Well, I was expecting oversized or overkill or waste of materials or something like that...

... and someone calling me crazy.

Those thoughts have all occurred to me, yes.

It's a capable boat, just a very expensive one for the capabilities.

If you want it to do many things, then it tends to become expensive (especially with that speed).

Quoted from "Rooijen10"

Well, I was expecting oversized or overkill or waste of materials or something like that...

... and someone calling me crazy. :)

Cavitation.

We are decent enough to let enemy submarines know from which direction their inevitable death is coming from.

Looks to me like a flawed concept.

First, current hydrophones are pretty crappy, especially if your moving at any sort of decent speed. Getting a good firing solution on a submarine is going to be hard.
Second, the sub is quite bulky, just as well it spends most of its time underwater as I'm sure it would time to dive if spotted on the surface.
Third, seems too expensive and too much overkill on the technical stuff.
But, it is fast and will give surface escorts a headache but its not too long before sonobouys and ASW aircraft and dipping sonars and helicopters even the balance once again. If anything the fact this is a big target for active sonar is a good thing, as it the cavitation.

Quoted

First, current hydrophones are pretty crappy, especially if your moving at any sort of decent speed. Getting a good firing solution on a submarine is going to be hard.

Isn't that what the sonar is for? I think that the chin wart sonar of the Tang-class looks better than that nose wart sonar of the Barracuda-class but regardless of the position, I would think that the sonar equipment there in combination with the eight forward firing torpedo tubes will require quite a bit of space there and result in a fairly wide and high submarine. Now, I could cut down on speed and range and make it shorter, but I don't want my sub to look like some short, stumpy garden gnome shooting though the water.

Regarding the hydrophones and speed, they are used when the submarine is using its silent running electric engines. At high speeds they will be pretty much useless with the subs own noise around but I would think that at about 7 knots, it should be okay.

Quoted

Second, the sub is quite bulky, just as well it spends most of its time underwater as I'm sure it would time to dive if spotted on the surface.

One reason I assigned tonnage to improved control surfaces, so it becomes a bit more maneuverable when it comes to going up or down or left or right.

But then, why would the submarine need to surface?

Quoted

But, it is fast and will give surface escorts a headache but its not too long before sonobouys and ASW aircraft and dipping sonars and helicopters even the balance once again.

True, but until then it will remain a headache.

*grumble, grumble* I was looking around at some of my sims and some ideas and noticed an error which I should have noticed earlier since the number of shells I entered just seemed off for some reason. I have no idea what I was doing when I calculated the total weight of the magazines because for 515 tons of 25mm ammunition is good for 25400 rounds per gun... which seems a bit extreme for those guns as it will take ~2 hours of almost continuous fire+several barrel changes to spend all that.

Quoted

5" => 500 rpg = 122 tons
75mm => 1500 rpg = 214 tons
40mm => 2000 rpg = 262 tons
25mm => 3000 rpg = 515 tons
Total magazine weight: 1113 tons = 1990 rounds

Should be

Quoted

5" => 500 rpg = 122 tons
75mm => 1500 rpg = 160 tons
40mm => 2000 rpg = 160 tons
25mm => 3000 rpg = 61 tons
Total magazine weight: 504 tons = 901 rounds

I added a bit more range to get the light displacement back down to 52,000 tons...


Nurikabe, Japan Carrier laid down 1944

Displacement:
52,000 t light; 53,685 t standard; 59,042 t normal; 63,328 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
937.09 ft / 910.00 ft x 112.00 ft x 35.00 ft (normal load)
285.63 m / 277.37 m x 34.14 m x 10.67 m

Armament:
8 - 5.00" / 127 mm guns (4x2 guns), 55.12lbs / 25.00kg shells, 1944 Model
Automatic rapid fire guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns (8x2 guns), 12.00lbs / 5.44kg shells, 1944 Model
Automatic rapid fire guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side ends, evenly spread
72 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (12x6 guns), 2.00lbs / 0.91kg shells, 1944 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
64 - 0.98" / 25.0 mm guns (16x4 guns), 0.57lbs / 0.26kg shells, 1944 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
48 - 0.98" / 25.0 mm guns (12x4 guns), 0.00lbs / 0.00kg shells, 1944 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 813 lbs / 369 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 901
336 - 4.7" / 120 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 6.00" / 152 mm 600.00 ft / 182.88 m 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 101 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
3.00" / 76 mm 600.00 ft / 182.88 m 33.00 ft / 10.06 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 3.00" / 76 mm 1.00" / 25 mm 2.00" / 51 mm
2nd: 1.00" / 25 mm - 1.00" / 25 mm
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
4th: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
5th: 0.50" / 13 mm - -

- Armour deck: 4.00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 2.75" / 70 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 156,514 shp / 116,759 Kw = 30.00 kts
Range 11,370nm at 18.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 9,644 tons

Complement:
1,893 - 2,461

Cost:
£16.743 million / $66.973 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 130 tons, 0.2 %
Armour: 10,154 tons, 17.2 %
- Belts: 2,142 tons, 3.6 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 2,198 tons, 3.7 %
- Armament: 89 tons, 0.2 %
- Armour Deck: 5,636 tons, 9.5 %
- Conning Tower: 90 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 3,997 tons, 6.8 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 15,219 tons, 25.8 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 7,043 tons, 11.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 22,500 tons, 38.1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
88,966 lbs / 40,354 Kg = 1,423.5 x 5.0 " / 127 mm shells or 14.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
Metacentric height 6.8 ft / 2.1 m
Roll period: 18.0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 61 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.02
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.56

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.579
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.13 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 34.69 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 39
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 30.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 4.00 ft / 1.22 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 40.00 ft / 12.19 m
- Forecastle (15 %): 25.60 ft / 7.80 m
- Mid (55 %): 25.60 ft / 7.80 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 25.60 ft / 7.80 m
- Stern: 25.60 ft / 7.80 m
- Average freeboard: 26.46 ft / 8.07 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 81.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 173.6 %
Waterplane Area: 76,165 Square feet or 7,076 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 142 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 144 lbs/sq ft or 701 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1.00
- Longitudinal: 0.99
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

5th Battery Shell weight too light

5" => 500 rpg = 122 tons
75mm => 1500 rpg = 160 tons
40mm => 2000 rpg = 160 tons
25mm => 3000 rpg = 61 tons
Total magazine weight: 504 tons = 901 rounds

Your 25mm are firing imaginary ammo by the looks of the sim.
Might want to check the 0 shell weight.

"336 - 4.7" / 120 mm above water torpedoes", what is this again?

Quoted from "thesmilingassassin"

"336 - 4.7" / 120 mm above water torpedoes", what is this again?

It shoots out a rainbow barrage of pool noodles. No combat utility but a hit at parties.

It represents the 12x28 12 cm AA Rocket launchers (12x28=336). It does not do much when it comes to the sim (since SS2 does not add any torpedo weights) except for to add a bit of volume being used aboard the ship although on a vessel of this size, I don't think it will have much influence on the "Space - Above water" stat of the sim. Still it looks to me to be a proper way of doing that in combination with the use of the 25mm mounts and the miscellaneous weights. It's something I have done on the more recent Japanese warships.

... so no Rocky, we're not talking about pool noodles here.

Quoted

... so no Rocky, we're not talking about pool noodles here.

Ramen noodles perhaps? :P

That would make them very hot ramen noodles then, considering the warhead on those rockets...

Miyake, Japan Kaibokan laid down 1947

Displacement:
1,000 t light; 1,109 t standard; 1,376 t normal; 1,589 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
319.65 ft / 305.00 ft x 35.00 ft x 11.00 ft (normal load)
97.43 m / 92.96 m x 10.67 m x 3.35 m

Armament:
4 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns (2x2 guns), 12.00lbs / 5.44kg shells, 1947 Model
Automatic rapid fire guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread
12 - 1.57" / 40.0 mm guns (2x6 guns), 2.00lbs / 0.91kg shells, 1947 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
16 - 0.98" / 25.0 mm guns (4x4 guns), 0.57lbs / 0.26kg shells, 1947 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships
Weight of broadside 81 lbs / 37 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 1,400

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.00" / 25 mm - 1.00" / 25 mm
2nd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -
3rd: 1.00" / 25 mm - -

- Conning tower: 2.75" / 70 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 12,198 shp / 9,100 Kw = 26.37 kts
Range 4,200nm at 20.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 479 tons

Complement:
112 - 146

Cost:
£0.632 million / $2.529 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 12 tons, 0.8 %
Armour: 16 tons, 1.1 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 8 tons, 0.6 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 7 tons, 0.5 %
Machinery: 301 tons, 21.9 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 321 tons, 23.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 376 tons, 27.3 %
Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 25.4 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
889 lbs / 403 Kg = 69.0 x 3.0 " / 75 mm shells or 0.5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
Metacentric height 1.2 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 13.5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.12
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.23

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.410
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.71 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 20.41 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 60 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 35.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 1.00 ft / 0.30 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 19.50 ft / 5.94 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
- Mid (50 %): 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
- Stern: 12.50 ft / 3.81 m
- Average freeboard: 13.06 ft / 3.98 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 111.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 145.9 %
Waterplane Area: 6,862 Square feet or 637 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 130 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 28 lbs/sq ft or 136 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.50
- Longitudinal: 1.37
- Overall: 0.55
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily


Actual rounds per gun:
75mm guns: 1500 rounds per gun
40mm guns: 2000 rounds per gun
25mm guns: 3000 rounds per gun
Total magazine weight: 82 tons = 1400 rounds

Ranges
2010 nm at 26 knots
3245 nm at 22 knots
4200 nm at 20 knots
5520 nm at 18 knots
8640 nm at 15 knots
14350 nm at 12 knots
21200 nm at 10 knots

Endurance
3 days, 5 hours, 18 minutes at 26 knots
6 days, 3 hours, 30 minutes at 22 knots
8 days, 18 hours at 20 knots
12 days, 18 hours, 40 minutes at 18 knots
24 days at 15 knots
49 days, 19 hours, 50 minutes at 12 knots
88 days, 8 hours at 10 knots

Fuel consumption (479 tons)
148.70 tons per day at 26 knots
77.94 tons per day at 22 knots
54.74 tons per day at 20 knots
37.49 tons per day at 18 knots
19.96 tons per day at 15 knots
9.61 tons per day at 12 knots
5.42 tons per day at 10 knots

- 40 tons for 2x Active Sonar
- 10 tons for Hydrophones
- 20 tons for Air Search Radar
- 10 tons for Surface Search Radar
- 15 tons for Fire Control
- 4 tons for 2 Depth Charge Projectors
- 8 tons for 8 Depth Charge Throwers
- 4 tons for 2 Depth Charge Chutes
- 40 tons for 120 Type 2 Depth Charges
- 2 tons for 81mm mortar + ammunition
- 60 tons for two Ika ASW mortars + ammunition
- 2 tons for 2 paravanes
- 15 tons for air condition system
- 5 tons for emergency diesel generators
- 61 tons for degaussing coils
- 16 for mount improvements
--- 8 tons for 75mm mounts
--- 4 tons for 40mm mounts
--- 4 tons for 25mm mounts
- 38 tons for miscellaneous

350t total

I am somewhat concerned with the percentage of the ship's displacement absorbed by the bunkers; at maximum displacement it is more than 30% of the total, and more than 27% at normal displacement.

Also, was this designed using SS3 or SS 2.1?