WesWorld

They just copy a solid design (read the Samanjir), reduce the armor and speed to save weight and then mass produced it. Is good to see Indian tech is being appreciated by other nations.

24 130mm guns, on a 220m hull, with 3 14" turrets. Looking at USS Alaska, a ship that was 20m longer, but only carried 12 5" guns, I have to wonder where all the additional 130mm guns will fit. Block coefficient seems a bit low as well.

the two catapults amidships on Alaska to one catapult aft on Khranitel saves quite a bit of space for guns amidships.

Just eyeballing my Alaska drawing, the belt lengths seem pretty similar, so the space for 130mm/5" guns should be too, were it not for the amidships catapults on Alaska.

A light carrier to provide scouting and fighter protection for forward-deployed forces.

She's a bit faster than most Russian carriers.

Grengam, Russian Aircraft Carrier laid down 1940

Displacement:
13,114 t light; 13,556 t standard; 16,270 t normal; 18,441 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
742.79 ft / 705.38 ft x 72.18 ft (Bulges 78.74 ft) x 20.51 ft (normal load)
226.40 m / 215.00 m x 22.00 m (Bulges 24.00 m) x 6.25 m

Armament:
8 - 5.12" / 130 mm guns (4x2 guns), 79.37lbs / 36.00kg shells, 1940 Model
Automatic rapid fire guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
24 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (6x4 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1940 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 672 lbs / 305 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 300

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 1.97" / 50 mm 426.51 ft / 130.00 m 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 93 % of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.20" / 5 mm -
3rd: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.20" / 5 mm -

- Armour deck: 1.97" / 50 mm, Conning tower: 1.18" / 30 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 94,630 shp / 70,594 Kw = 32.00 kts
Range 12,200nm at 18.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 4,885 tons

Complement:
719 - 936

Cost:
£5.308 million / $21.233 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 85 tons, 0.5 %
Armour: 1,667 tons, 10.2 %
- Belts: 349 tons, 2.1 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 18 tons, 0.1 %
- Armour Deck: 1,285 tons, 7.9 %
- Conning Tower: 16 tons, 0.1 %
Machinery: 2,530 tons, 15.6 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,432 tons, 33.4 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3,156 tons, 19.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 3,400 tons, 20.9 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
23,912 lbs / 10,846 Kg = 356.7 x 5.1 " / 130 mm shells or 2.8 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.17
Metacentric height 4.1 ft / 1.2 m
Roll period: 16.4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.08
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.25

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.500
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.96 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 30.57 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 56
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 35.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 39.37 ft / 12.00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 32.81 ft / 10.00 m
- Mid (50 %): 14.11 ft / 4.30 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 14.11 ft / 4.30 m
- Stern: 20.34 ft / 6.20 m
- Average freeboard: 21.65 ft / 6.60 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 78.3 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 172.2 %
Waterplane Area: 35,276 Square feet or 3,277 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 151 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 103 lbs/sq ft or 503 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1.00
- Longitudinal: 1.00
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

4 twin automatic DP mounts - 40 tons
Flight Deck-226.4m*30m
Aviation-2 Catapults, 42 Fighters, 14 Scouts - 3,186 tons
Electronics fit:
Air search radar - 10 tons
AA fire control radar - 10 tons
Aerial Combat Information Center - 150 tons

Quoted

Looks like Russia really intends to be quite heavy on light capital ships. Why is this?

Russian Federation naval staff have noticed the proliferation of light cruisers with 12-15 152mm guns. RF naval staff intend to deal with them at a distance.

Russia also needs big ships because big ships can carry more fuel for greater range. Having Murmansk as my main fleet base puts the Russian Navy far away from areas Russian allies have interests.

Quoted

This is almost an old fashioned BC of Great War vintage....

{laughs} Well, one of my options for this requirement was a 15000 ton Light 30 knot BC with 8 305mm and little more armor than the 1906 Invincible. Brock and Wes talked me out of it.

It always baffled me why Their Lordships of the Admiralty hung a name like Invincible on a ship with a 6-inch main belt and a 7-inch main battery turret face.

Quoted

It always baffled me why Their Lordships of the Admiralty hung a name like Invincible on a ship with a 6-inch main belt and a 7-inch main battery turret face.

Because that armour actually gave pretty good protection against likely threats, including large calibre guns. It's difficult for the DNC to forsee that much more effective armour piercing shells would be developed around 1912.

Those big cruisers are an awfully expensive way to cope with 152mm armed cruisers. Especially as in real life their cost would be considerably higher than the tonnage would indicate.

I think he's referring to the 9.2'' designs, RA, not the aircraft carrier defense ship, to defend against capital threats when bad weather prevents planes from flying.

Quoted

Originally posted by TexanCowboy
I think he's referring to the 9.2'' designs, RA, not the aircraft carrier defense ship, to defend against capital threats when bad weather prevents planes from flying.

The cruisers with 9.2" guns are also covered in the expensive category.

I'm not quite sure they pass the common sense test myself. A lot more capability than Brooklyn but in the same size hull. Doubt it'd work out well in practise.

the General-Admiral Apraksin class.

These four ships are getting modern radars and comm gear, upgraded turret armor, and a service life extension.

Gen-Adm Apraksin, refit 1940, Russian Light Cruiser laid down 1922

Displacement:
7,391 t light; 7,852 t standard; 8,981 t normal; 9,884 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
609.58 ft / 590.55 ft x 54.79 ft x 20.67 ft (normal load)
185.80 m / 180.00 m x 16.70 m x 6.30 m

Armament:
12 - 5.98" / 152 mm guns (4x3 guns), 123.46lbs / 56.00kg shells, 1940 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
12 - 3.94" / 100 mm guns (6x2 guns), 37.48lbs / 17.00kg shells, 1940 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
24 - 1.46" / 37.0 mm guns (6x4 guns), 1.55lbs / 0.70kg shells, 1940 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
8 - 0.55" / 14.0 mm guns (4x2 guns), 0.08lbs / 0.04kg shells, 1940 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 1,969 lbs / 893 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 240
12 - 21.7" / 550 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 2.95" / 75 mm 410.11 ft / 125.00 m 9.84 ft / 3.00 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 107 % of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 3.54" / 90 mm 2.36" / 60 mm 2.76" / 70 mm
2nd: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.20" / 5 mm -
3rd: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.20" / 5 mm -

- Armour deck: 0.98" / 25 mm, Conning tower: 1.97" / 50 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 63,673 shp / 47,500 Kw = 31.50 kts
Range 9,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,032 tons

Complement:
460 - 599

Cost:
£2.014 million / $8.056 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 211 tons, 2.4 %
Armour: 1,189 tons, 13.2 %
- Belts: 488 tons, 5.4 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 286 tons, 3.2 %
- Armour Deck: 397 tons, 4.4 %
- Conning Tower: 18 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 2,160 tons, 24.0 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 3,650 tons, 40.6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,590 tons, 17.7 %
Miscellaneous weights: 180 tons, 2.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
10,277 lbs / 4,661 Kg = 95.9 x 6.0 " / 152 mm shells or 1.4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.08
Metacentric height 2.4 ft / 0.7 m
Roll period: 15.0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.78
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.20

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.470
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.78 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 27.67 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 58
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 25.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 6.56 ft / 2.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26.74 ft / 8.15 m
- Forecastle (26 %): 18.04 ft / 5.50 m
- Mid (50 %): 17.22 ft / 5.25 m
- Quarterdeck (25 %): 18.04 ft / 5.50 m
- Stern: 19.69 ft / 6.00 m
- Average freeboard: 18.95 ft / 5.78 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100.4 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 116.0 %
Waterplane Area: 21,813 Square feet or 2,027 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 122 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 101 lbs/sq ft or 493 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.41
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

2 seaplanes, 1 catapult - 70 tons
Surface search radar - 20 tons
Air search radar - 20 tons
Main battery fire control radar - 10 tons
AA battery fire control radar - 10 tons
Misc - 50 tons

This subject originally goes back to my very early days here, before I learned much about Springsharp.

If I read the SS correctly, none of the turrets are superfiring - or am I still missing something?

You are correct, no superfiring turrets.

I've asked the Admiral about this several times in the past, he has always told me this is a deliberate deisgn layout for his ships...

Quoted

Originally posted by eltf177
You are correct, no superfiring turrets.

I've asked the Admiral about this several times in the past, he has always told me this is a deliberate deisgn layout for his ships...

I recall that some of the pre-WWI Tsarist battleships had such a layout - all the main turrets on the centerline at deck level.

see major advantages in reduced topweight and increased stability from not having superfiring main battery mounts, and considering the scouting resources available to a Battle Group or Armored Cruiser Group, discount the risk of getting their "T" crossed.

For light cruisers and destroyers, especially those operating independently, these advantages are outweighed by the likelihood of threats materializing by surprise directly ahead, so they accept the disadvantages of superfiring main battery mounts in these cases.