WesWorld

Since every other statelet has a capital ship so should Danzig!

Ladies(?) and Gentlemen let me present the future flagship (and indeed only ship) of Danzig the Battleship Hansastadt Danzig!

Hansastadt Danzig, Danzig/Coldemere Battle Cruiser laid down 1937

Displacement:
34 179 t light; 35 735 t standard; 38 145 t normal; 40 073 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
803,81 ft / 803,81 ft x 88,58 ft x 29,53 ft (normal load)
245,00 m / 245,00 m x 27,00 m x 9,00 m

Armament:
6 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (3x2 guns), 2 048,00lbs / 928,96kg shells, 1937 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
28 - 4,53" / 115 mm guns (14x2 guns), 55,12lbs / 25,00kg shells, 1937 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
32 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns (8x4 guns), 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1937 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
12 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns (2x6 guns), 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1937 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 13 884 lbs / 6 298 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 15,7" / 400 mm 475,72 ft / 145,00 m 11,09 ft / 3,38 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 7,87" / 200 mm 475,72 ft / 145,00 m 8,20 ft / 2,50 m
Main Belt covers 91 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
2,36" / 60 mm 475,72 ft / 145,00 m 24,11 ft / 7,35 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 15,7" / 400 mm 8,66" / 220 mm 7,87" / 200 mm
2nd: 3,15" / 80 mm 2,36" / 60 mm 2,36" / 60 mm
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -
4th: 0,47" / 12 mm - -

- Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 3,94" / 100 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Electric motors, 4 shafts, 142 816 shp / 106 540 Kw = 31,00 kts
Range 9 000nm at 15,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 4 338 tons

Complement:
1 364 - 1 774

Cost:
£17,360 million / $69,439 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1 705 tons, 4,5 %
Armour: 14 339 tons, 37,6 %
- Belts: 4 881 tons, 12,8 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1 003 tons, 2,6 %
- Armament: 2 229 tons, 5,8 %
- Armour Deck: 6 130 tons, 16,1 %
- Conning Tower: 96 tons, 0,3 %
Machinery: 3 958 tons, 10,4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 13 977 tons, 36,6 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3 965 tons, 10,4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 0,5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
57 236 lbs / 25 962 Kg = 27,9 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 7,8 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 5,1 ft / 1,6 m
Roll period: 16,4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,84
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,11

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,635
Length to Beam Ratio: 9,07 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 32,15 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 46
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 31,17 ft / 9,50 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m (19,69 ft / 6,00 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 19,69 ft / 6,00 m
- Stern: 19,69 ft / 6,00 m
- Average freeboard: 23,36 ft / 7,12 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 88,4 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 178,0 %
Waterplane Area: 56 110 Square feet or 5 213 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 106 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 175 lbs/sq ft or 853 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,98
- Longitudinal: 1,11
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
Since every other statelet has a capital ship so should Danzig!

That does it.
Luxembourg's going to have to lay down a ship that can beat the Hanaastadt Danzig!!!

Quoted

Originally posted by Kaiser Kirk

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
Since every other statelet has a capital ship so should Danzig!

That does it.
Luxembourg's going to have to lay down a ship that can beat the Hanaastadt Danzig!!!

Don't forget San Marino, Andorra, and Leichstenstien!!!

Monaco probably already got one....

I was actually once amusing myself by drawing up some destroyers for the Knights of Malta...

I used this as a backstory for some aircraft drawings for the Sovereign Military Order of Malta (or Hospitallers)

After having its territory restored at the Vienna Congress the Knights Hospitaller or Sovereign Military Order of Malta set about rebuilding its naval strength and the newly built Fulques de Villaret Naval Acadamy came to be one of the most prestigious in the world. Although SMOM was strictly neutral in European affairs it was fighting a never ending war against Berber pirates and on a number of occasions the Ottoman Empire ( during the Greek War of Independence and the First Balkan War), so when the Ottomans entered Worldwar One it was no surprise that SMOM declared war and fought valiantly at sea, Gallipoli and the Middle East (SMOM never declared war on Germany, Austro-Hungary and Bulgaria) for which it was rewarded with Smyrna (ceded in 1923 to Turkey) and Acre. Between the wars SMOM built up a small but very modern aircraft industry on Gozo. Strictly neutral in WW2 until the Italian capitulation, SMOM declared war in 1945 but gave the allies access to the great harbor of Valleta from October 1943.

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
I used this as a backstory for some aircraft drawings for the Sovereign Military Order of Malta (or Hospitallers)

After having its territory restored at the Vienna Congress the Knights Hospitaller or Sovereign Military Order of Malta set about rebuilding its naval strength and the newly built Fulques de Villaret Naval Acadamy came to be one of the most prestigious in the world. Although SMOM was strictly neutral in European affairs it was fighting a never ending war against Berber pirates and on a number of occasions the Ottoman Empire ( during the Greek War of Independence and the First Balkan War), so when the Ottomans entered Worldwar One it was no surprise that SMOM declared war and fought valiantly at sea, Gallipoli and the Middle East (SMOM never declared war on Germany, Austro-Hungary and Bulgaria) for which it was rewarded with Smyrna (ceded in 1923 to Turkey) and Acre. Between the wars SMOM built up a small but very modern aircraft industry on Gozo. Strictly neutral in WW2 until the Italian capitulation, SMOM declared war in 1945 but gave the allies access to the great harbor of Valleta from October 1943.

That's a very interesting history, actually.

I know someone was bouncing around the idea of building a small Swiss Navy to protect the Swiss Merchant Marine... I'd thought about Ireland just building them a DD, just for fun!

The Sea going Swiss merchant fleet is based in France (IIRC) so an agreement with the French would probably be necessary

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
I used this as a backstory for some aircraft drawings for the Sovereign Military Order of Malta (or Hospitallers)

After having its territory restored at the Vienna Congress the Knights Hospitaller or Sovereign Military Order of Malta set about rebuilding its naval strength and the newly built Fulques de Villaret Naval Acadamy came to be one of the most prestigious in the world. Although SMOM was strictly neutral in European affairs it was fighting a never ending war against Berber pirates and on a number of occasions the Ottoman Empire ( during the Greek War of Independence and the First Balkan War), so when the Ottomans entered Worldwar One it was no surprise that SMOM declared war and fought valiantly at sea, Gallipoli and the Middle East (SMOM never declared war on Germany, Austro-Hungary and Bulgaria) for which it was rewarded with Smyrna (ceded in 1923 to Turkey) and Acre. Between the wars SMOM built up a small but very modern aircraft industry on Gozo. Strictly neutral in WW2 until the Italian capitulation, SMOM declared war in 1945 but gave the allies access to the great harbor of Valleta from October 1943.

That´s probably worth keeping in mind should we ever run WesWorld 2.0. Would make for a lovely small place for a player more interested in roleplaying than power gaming. Keeping such small power alive sounds like a real task.... Probably something for The Rock Doctor! ;o)

Yeah, well unless the player decides that Margat and Krak de Chevaliers need to return to the order....

I had something of an amusing idea I wanted to pitch if Wesworld II comes about: a surviving Crusader state in Palestine, with a bunch of enclaves all down the Red Sea (basically, holding Israel, Jordan, and Hedjaz); stuck between the Egyptians to the west and a Saudi-Persian kingdom to the east.

That would probably also mean that the Teutonic order and the Hospitallers remain in the holy land (and possibly the Templars), a unified Crusader state or a confederation of statelets like there was in the 12th and 13th century?

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
That would probably also mean that the Teutonic order and the Hospitallers remain in the holy land (and possibly the Templars), a unified Crusader state or a confederation of statelets like there was in the 12th and 13th century?

As I recall it ended up as a unified kingdom with close ties to France and Italy; kinda batted it about in my head as "The Kingdom of Jerusalem and Palestine". Very much an anti-Islamic state, fairly modern and populous, perhaps interests in Cyprus; holds the Suez Canal; a Type 3 port in Joppa and another in Eilat.

I actually started writing it more as an independent writing project, even before I started playing WW. The Crusaders were at war with the Egyptians and their Persian allies, and the story would have followed extensive cruiser and destroyer skirmishes on the Red Sea between the three navies.

My force structure ended up formed around a single armoured cruiser (nine 25cm guns) and three coast-defense ships with six 25cm guns. The Med was the main theatre, with two CDS escorting convoys against Egyptian light cruisers, and the armoured cruiser and the second CDS running missions down to Aden to prevent Persian reinforcements from reaching Egypt. Meanwhile the Jerusalemite Navy had to run supplies to the Camel Corps in the Arabian Desert...

If we assume that the Crusader state survived 1291 (OTL fall at which time it was unified since the Prinicipality of Antioch and County of Edessa had already fallen) and the Lusignan´s held on to Cyprus (as OTL) then it is a respectable country in a very important strategic position.
Persia and Egypt are probably hostile but I doubt that they would cooperate.

If there ever is a WW2 and it includes a SMOM Malta then they will need an impressive Flagship, Let me present the Blessed Gerard

Beatus Gerard, Malta Battleship laid down 1937

Displacement:
56 480 t light; 59 965 t standard; 63 300 t normal; 65 968 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
908,56 ft / 885,83 ft x 104,99 ft (Bulges 111,55 ft) x 33,46 ft (normal load)
276,93 m / 270,00 m x 32,00 m (Bulges 34,00 m) x 10,20 m

Armament:
12 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (4x3 guns), 2 048,00lbs / 928,96kg shells, 1937 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
24 - 5,12" / 130 mm guns (12x2 guns), 67,03lbs / 30,41kg shells, 1937 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
40 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (10x4 guns), 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1937 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 26 263 lbs / 11 913 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 15,7" / 400 mm 508,53 ft / 155,00 m 13,12 ft / 4,00 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 7,87" / 200 mm 508,53 ft / 155,00 m 13,12 ft / 4,00 m
Main Belt covers 88 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead and Bulges:
3,15" / 80 mm 656,17 ft / 200,00 m 9,84 ft / 3,00 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 16,9" / 430 mm 11,8" / 300 mm 7,87" / 200 mm
2nd: 2,76" / 70 mm 2,36" / 60 mm 2,36" / 60 mm
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -

- Armour deck: 7,87" / 200 mm, Conning tower: 7,87" / 200 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 193 565 shp / 144 400 Kw = 31,00 kts
Range 9 000nm at 15,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 6 004 tons

Complement:
1 994 - 2 593

Cost:
£29,921 million / $119,683 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 3 283 tons, 5,2 %
Armour: 23 339 tons, 36,9 %
- Belts: 6 868 tons, 10,9 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 753 tons, 1,2 %
- Armament: 4 418 tons, 7,0 %
- Armour Deck: 11 031 tons, 17,4 %
- Conning Tower: 269 tons, 0,4 %
Machinery: 5 365 tons, 8,5 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 24 233 tons, 38,3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 6 820 tons, 10,8 %
Miscellaneous weights: 260 tons, 0,4 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
97 785 lbs / 44 355 Kg = 47,7 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 12,1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13
Metacentric height 6,7 ft / 2,1 m
Roll period: 18,0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,89
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,29

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,670
Length to Beam Ratio: 7,94 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 33,99 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 52 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 40
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 30,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 39,37 ft / 12,00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 32,81 ft / 10,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 32,81 ft / 10,00 m (26,25 ft / 8,00 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Stern: 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Average freeboard: 30,05 ft / 9,16 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 84,8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 211,8 %
Waterplane Area: 75 726 Square feet or 7 035 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 104 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 221 lbs/sq ft or 1 079 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,97
- Longitudinal: 1,32
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Quoted

Let me present the Blessed Gerard

He shall send blessing to you with its 16 inch guns.

"You may fire when ready, Brother Gridley."

"Let us pray that the Lord strikes down our enemies, and if he doesn't let the sixteen inchers so it!"

A new try at designing a battleship that may be a bit slow

Basilisk, Danzig Battleship laid down 1940

Displacement:
36 324 t light; 38 242 t standard; 40 455 t normal; 42 226 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
885,83 ft / 885,83 ft x 98,43 ft x 29,53 ft (normal load)
270,00 m / 270,00 m x 30,00 m x 9,00 m

Armament:
6 - 16,00" / 406 mm guns (3x2 guns), 2 048,00lbs / 928,96kg shells, 1940 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
12 - 5,00" / 127 mm guns (6x2 guns), 62,50lbs / 28,35kg shells, 1940 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
40 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (10x4 guns), 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1940 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 13 116 lbs / 5 949 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 15,7" / 400 mm 433,07 ft / 132,00 m 13,12 ft / 4,00 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Upper: 11,8" / 300 mm 433,07 ft / 132,00 m 8,01 ft / 2,44 m
Main Belt covers 75 % of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
3,15" / 80 mm 433,07 ft / 132,00 m 18,08 ft / 5,51 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 15,7" / 400 mm 11,8" / 300 mm 7,87" / 200 mm
2nd: 3,15" / 80 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 3,15" / 80 mm
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -

- Armour deck: 5,91" / 150 mm, Conning tower: 7,87" / 200 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 96 645 shp / 72 097 Kw = 28,00 kts
Range 8 000nm at 15,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3 984 tons

Complement:
1 426 - 1 854

Cost:
£18,062 million / $72,247 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1 640 tons, 4,1 %
Armour: 16 142 tons, 39,9 %
- Belts: 5 784 tons, 14,3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 912 tons, 2,3 %
- Armament: 2 325 tons, 5,7 %
- Armour Deck: 6 921 tons, 17,1 %
- Conning Tower: 200 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 2 584 tons, 6,4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 15 958 tons, 39,4 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4 132 tons, 10,2 %
Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
82 099 lbs / 37 240 Kg = 40,1 x 16,0 " / 406 mm shells or 13,4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13
Metacentric height 6,1 ft / 1,9 m
Roll period: 16,7 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,65
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,42

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,550
Length to Beam Ratio: 9,00 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 34,05 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 29,53 ft / 9,00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m (19,69 ft / 6,00 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (20 %): 19,69 ft / 6,00 m
- Stern: 19,69 ft / 6,00 m
- Average freeboard: 23,23 ft / 7,08 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 66,5 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 194,3 %
Waterplane Area: 63 348 Square feet or 5 885 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 118 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 182 lbs/sq ft or 886 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1,00
- Longitudinal: 1,03
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Armor is good, speed is fine (plenty of 28-knot BBs out there), dimensions seem excessive for the tonnage, firepower is weak (only 6 16" guns and 12 5").