WesWorld

By the treaty of Cleito the French are allowed to posess 6 capital ships. Why are there 10 in the Med. alone?

Could you elaborate Adm. kuznetsov?

I was curious. Were you looking at Admiral K's website or do you have another source where you got that?
I get the impression that the ship list on his site is the list of 1/1/1921 (before scapping).

Cause the ships given in his 1922 report give us the number of capital ships as 6.

(could be some evil french plan to throw us off guard though)

Walter

The list of ships on his site is indeed for 1/1/1921. His 2nd report gives the status of the ships to be scrapped. France is left with 3 Bretagne class and 3 Courbet class ships. If only i knew where they were.....


(Italy's evil plans seem more obvious)

Quoted

(Italy's evil plans seem more obvious)

Well, Japan's evil plans migh be less obvious because there are soooooo many islands that make up the Empire of Japan, who would notice it when, all of a sudden, several 'islands' would appear out of nowhere or vanish into thin air.

:-)

Walter

Long ago, I made the following post concerning the French capital ships and cruisers being retained:

French capital Ships

I trust the information there will satisfy your curiosity.

Many of the ships being scrapped have been sent to various colonial possessions, where their armaments will reinforce the coast artillery of their locations. So, while France will indeed retain a limited number of capital ships, it would be a grave mistake indeed to believe that French territory or colonial possessions would be a simple matter to acquire.

"Well, Japan's evil plans migh be less obvious because there are soooooo many islands that make up the Empire of Japan, who would notice it when, all of a sudden, several 'islands' would appear out of nowhere or vanish into thin air."

Hopefully those 4 Kongo's don't do the same...it would be most unfortunate.

Quoted

Hopefully those 4 Kongo's don't do the same...it would be most unfortunate

You mean appear? Would be quite fortunate if they did since that would fill up four of the six gaps in my Capital Ships list.

They vanished during the war, but how suspicious would it be if they had vanished right after the treaty was signed? (Or right after 1/1/1921)
:-)

Walter

"Would be quite fortunate if they did since that would fill up four of the six gaps in my Capital Ships list."

I guess that would depend on weather or not they are the historical design or not. The historical Kongos came up short against other capital ships, you acctually benifit from not having them as you can replace them with units fitted with better armor!

You can find her here in this thread

It's quite a list so here's what I made of it:

Kongo, Japan Battlecruiser laid down 1911
Ships: 4. Kongo, Hiei, Haruna, Kirishima

Displacement:
28,065 t light; 29,800 t standard; 34,482 t normal; 38,090 t full load
Loading submergence 1,407 tons/feet

Dimensions:
680.00 ft x 102.00 ft x 29.00 ft (normal load)
207.26 m x 31.09 m x 8.84 m

Armament:
8 - 14.17" / 360 mm guns (4 Main turrets x 2 guns, 2 superfiring turrets)
Aft turrets separated by engine room
16 - 5.12" / 130 mm guns
Secondary guns mounted low & subject to being washed down in a seaway
18 - 1.97" / 50 mm QF guns
30 - 0.98" / 25 mm guns
Weight of broadside 12,544 lbs / 5,690 kg
2 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm submerged torpedo tubes

Armour:
Belt 11.00" / 279 mm, ends unarmoured
Belts cover 101 % of normal area
Main turrets 12.00" / 305 mm, 2nd casemates 4.00" / 102 mm
QF gun shields 1.00" / 25 mm, Light gun shields 1.00" / 25 mm
Armour deck 2.00" / 51 mm, Conning tower 12.00" / 305 mm
Torpedo bulkhead 2.00" / 51 mm

Machinery:
Coal and oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 111,269 shp / 83,006 Kw = 28.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 15.00 kts

Complement:
1,265 - 1,644

Cost:
£2.946 million / $11.785 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,568 tons, 4.5 %
Armour: 8,956 tons, 26.0 %
Belts: 2,558 tons, 7.4 %, Armament: 3,352 tons, 9.7 %, Armour Deck: 1,823 tons, 5.3 %
Conning Tower: 275 tons, 0.8 %, Torpedo bulkhead: 949 tons, 2.8 %
Machinery: 4,621 tons, 13.4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 12,820 tons, 37.2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 6,417 tons, 18.6 %
Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 0.3 %

Metacentric height 6.8

Remarks:
Hull space for machinery, storage & compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation & workspaces is excellent

Estimated overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Relative margin of stability: 1.16
Shellfire needed to sink: 35,184 lbs / 15,959 Kg = 24.7 x 14.2 " / 360 mm shells
(Approx weight of penetrating shell hits needed to sink ship excluding critical hits)
Torpedoes needed to sink: 4.7
(Approx number of typical torpedo hits needed to sink ship)
Relative steadiness as gun platform: 53 %
(Average = 50 %)
Relative rocking effect from firing to beam: 0.44
Relative quality as seaboat: 1.05

Hull form characteristics:
Block coefficient: 0.600
Sharpness coefficient: 0.41
Hull speed coefficient 'M': 6.39
'Natural speed' for length: 26.08 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
Trim: 50
(Maximise stabilty/flotation = 0, Maximise steadiness/seakeeping = 100)

Estimated hull characteristics & strength:
Underwater volume absorbed by magazines and engineering spaces: 100.0 %
Relative accommodation and working space: 163.2 %
(Average = 100%)
Displacement factor: 112 %
(Displacement relative to loading factors)
Relative cross-sectional hull strength: 0.97
(Structure weight / hull surface area: 186 lbs / square foot or 909 Kg / square metre)
Relative longitudinal hull strength: 1.35
(for 22.00 ft / 6.71 m average freeboard, freeboard adjustment 2.60 ft)
Relative composite hull strength: 1.00

In my opinion, it's not too bad a ship (compared to what they were historically).

Walter