WesWorld

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
the problem with the Isfahans is that i dont like them...

Expensive, short ranged and weak armament as for a CL why arm them with DD guns?

Not meglamaniacal enough?

Seriously though, they are more a destroyer leader or scout cruiser than a true CL. They have a respectable torpedo armament and good speed, whats not to like?

The Speed is good, torpedo armament only 4x24", range is short, AA is weak. Good for blockading the Hormuz strait but not enough once the Bactrian coast needs defending, it would also be nice to be able to support our allies in trade protection.

E-1v4, Persia Escort laid down 1936

Displacement:
2 781 t light; 2 972 t standard; 3 201 t normal; 3 385 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
412,92 ft / 410,11 ft x 37,73 ft (Bulges 39,37 ft) x 15,42 ft (normal load)
125,86 m / 125,00 m x 11,50 m (Bulges 12,00 m) x 4,70 m

Armament:
6 - 5,12" / 130 mm guns (2x3 guns), 67,03lbs / 30,40kg shells, 1936 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread
4 - 5,12" / 130 mm guns (2x2 guns), 67,03lbs / 30,40kg shells, 1936 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
40 - 0,98" / 25,0 mm guns (10x4 guns), 0,48lbs / 0,22kg shells, 1936 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 690 lbs / 313 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 300
8 - 24,0" / 609,6 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 2,76" / 70 mm 2,36" / 60 mm -
2nd: 2,36" / 60 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -

- Armour deck: 1,18" / 30 mm, Conning tower: 3,15" / 80 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 51 991 shp / 38 785 Kw = 34,00 kts
Range 7 500nm at 11,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 413 tons

Complement:
212 - 276

Cost:
£1,887 million / $7,547 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 86 tons, 2,7 %
Armour: 315 tons, 9,9 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 77 tons, 2,4 %
- Armour Deck: 224 tons, 7,0 %
- Conning Tower: 15 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 1 344 tons, 42,0 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 935 tons, 29,2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 420 tons, 13,1 %
Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 3,1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
874 lbs / 396 Kg = 13,0 x 5,1 " / 130 mm shells or 0,4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,02
Metacentric height 1,2 ft / 0,4 m
Roll period: 15,1 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 1,00
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,450
Length to Beam Ratio: 10,42 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23,18 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 66 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 70
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 7,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22,97 ft / 7,00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Stern: 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Average freeboard: 16,93 ft / 5,16 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 162,0 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 80,8 %
Waterplane Area: 10 252 Square feet or 952 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 80 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 45 lbs/sq ft or 218 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,50
- Longitudinal: 1,80
- Overall: 0,57
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is cramped
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, for torpedoes and other stuff

Since DP tripples dont work how about this? How much does a quad TT launhcer weigh?

Isn't this the same one you showed before? It still has 2 triple 130mm's fore and aft....

The tripples are no longer DP

E-1v5, Persia Escort laid down 1936

Displacement:
2 781 t light; 2 972 t standard; 3 201 t normal; 3 385 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
412,92 ft / 410,11 ft x 37,73 ft (Bulges 39,37 ft) x 15,42 ft (normal load)
125,86 m / 125,00 m x 11,50 m (Bulges 12,00 m) x 4,70 m

Armament:
6 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (2x3 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1936 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread
6 - 2,95" / 75,0 mm guns (3x2 guns), 12,87lbs / 5,84kg shells, 1936 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, majority forward, all raised mounts - superfiring
40 - 0,98" / 25,0 mm guns (10x4 guns), 0,48lbs / 0,22kg shells, 1936 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 714 lbs / 324 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 300
12 - 24,0" / 609,6 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 2,76" / 70 mm 2,36" / 60 mm -
2nd: 2,36" / 60 mm 1,97" / 50 mm -
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm - -

- Armour deck: 1,18" / 30 mm, Conning tower: 3,15" / 80 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 51 991 shp / 38 785 Kw = 34,00 kts
Range 7 500nm at 11,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 413 tons

Complement:
212 - 276

Cost:
£1,898 million / $7,593 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 89 tons, 2,8 %
Armour: 317 tons, 9,9 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0 %
- Armament: 78 tons, 2,4 %
- Armour Deck: 224 tons, 7,0 %
- Conning Tower: 15 tons, 0,5 %
Machinery: 1 341 tons, 41,9 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 934 tons, 29,2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 420 tons, 13,1 %
Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 3,1 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
868 lbs / 394 Kg = 8,4 x 5,9 " / 150 mm shells or 0,4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,00
Metacentric height 1,2 ft / 0,4 m
Roll period: 15,4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 67 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,96
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,01

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,450
Length to Beam Ratio: 10,42 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23,18 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 66 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 66
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 7,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22,97 ft / 7,00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Mid (50 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Stern: 16,40 ft / 5,00 m
- Average freeboard: 16,93 ft / 5,16 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 162,3 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 45,6 %
Waterplane Area: 10 252 Square feet or 952 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 79 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 45 lbs/sq ft or 218 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,50
- Longitudinal: 1,82
- Overall: 0,57
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is extremely poor


With re-arranged armament

No comments?

Myself, I like the last design best, but (wearing my German hat) I could suggest purchasing a couple of Seljuk-type vessels. They can be found here: http://88.198.26.117/kunden/oponn/wbblit…55585#post55585

Looks interesting but of course anything Turkish is out of the question

It's German.

Heh, it's not Turkish, it's a German design that was built for the Turks, it's based on the German Lebrecht Maas class large destroyers, but trading off seakeeping (which the Turks don't need as much as the KM does) for speed. Large portions of the Turkish fleet are either ex-German, built in German yards, or to German designs (though there are, of course, exceptions).

It doesnt mention Germany anywhere, as escorts for the Maekong they will have to be able to operate in the indian ocean so range might be a bit short

That trend seems to bid fair for Bulgaria, too. After all, I'm getting some German-designed/influenced CLs... I have a German-built BB... German-derived TBs... I will someday have German Z-214 DDs... and I have my eye on getting one or two Seljuks myself.

Makes sense to co-ordinate equipment with ones allies

If a potential purchaser was interested in trading a lower cruising speed for longer cruising range, the gearing in the transmission system could be adjusted. As a hypothetical example, a version of Seljuk could be delivered with a cruising speed of 11 knots and a cruising range of 9500 nm, while increasing the designs reserved weight by 10 tons.

Well if the Persians are willing to forgo armor, Mexico could fix them up with a version of this nifty design:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y22/Ren…coGunboat-1.gif
Middle on left side.

Tigre, Mexico Heavy Destroyer laid down 1938

Displacement:
2,032 t light; 2,141 t standard; 2,783 t normal; 3,297 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
390.00 ft / 390.00 ft x 37.00 ft x 15.00 ft (normal load)
118.87 m / 118.87 m x 11.28 m x 4.57 m

Armament:
10 - 5.00" / 127 mm guns (5x2 guns), 62.50lbs / 28.35kg shells, 1938 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, majority aft, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
4 - 1.10" / 27.9 mm guns (1x4 guns), 0.67lbs / 0.30kg shells, 1938 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mount
on centreline amidships, all raised guns - superfiring
4 - 1.10" / 27.9 mm guns (2x2 guns), 0.67lbs / 0.30kg shells, 1938 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships
Weight of broadside 630 lbs / 286 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
8 - 21.0" / 533.4 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 1.00" / 25 mm - -

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 43,126 shp / 32,172 Kw = 33.00 kts
Range 12,500nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,156 tons

Complement:
191 - 249

Cost:
£1.667 million / $6.666 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 79 tons, 2.8 %
Armour: 24 tons, 0.9 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 24 tons, 0.9 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0.0 %
Machinery: 1,131 tons, 40.6 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 748 tons, 26.9 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 751 tons, 27.0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 50 tons, 1.8 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
896 lbs / 406 Kg = 14.3 x 5.0 " / 127 mm shells or 0.4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.19
Metacentric height 1.6 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 12.5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.93
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.01

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.450
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.54 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.58 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 65 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 69
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 21.00 ft / 6.40 m
- Forecastle (15 %): 17.00 ft / 5.18 m
- Mid (50 %): 17.00 ft / 5.18 m (14.00 ft / 4.27 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (11 %): 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Stern: 14.00 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 15.74 ft / 4.80 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 155.1 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 90.9 %
Waterplane Area: 9,561 Square feet or 888 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 91 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 40 lbs/sq ft or 196 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.50
- Longitudinal: 1.62
- Overall: 0.56
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

A modified design could be of interest, since we are not that keen to introduce yet more types of weapons, PM me a price suggestion

Quoted

Originally posted by Hrolf Hakonson
If a potential purchaser was interested in trading a lower cruising speed for longer cruising range, the gearing in the transmission system could be adjusted. As a hypothetical example, a version of Seljuk could be delivered with a cruising speed of 11 knots and a cruising range of 9500 nm, while increasing the designs reserved weight by 10 tons.

Could you PM me a price suggestion

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad

Quoted

Originally posted by Hrolf Hakonson
If a potential purchaser was interested in trading a lower cruising speed for longer cruising range, the gearing in the transmission system could be adjusted. As a hypothetical example, a version of Seljuk could be delivered with a cruising speed of 11 knots and a cruising range of 9500 nm, while increasing the designs reserved weight by 10 tons.

Could you PM me a price suggestion

Done, with the modified design.