WesWorld

The Argentine Army is issuing a requirement for a new heavy AA gun to replace the 75mm Bofors Model 1929 and 75mm M31/AM1 L/50 guns now in service.
Specifications are left open to allow as many contenders to choose from as possible.
The limits are; minimum calibre 75mm and minimum effective ceiling 7,250m.
The gun and mount should be reasonably mobile with minimum of disassembly. Fire-control equipment should be attached to the mount for local control and should offer reasonable accuracy as a redundancy for the main battery fire-control equipment.

The contract will include training equipment, spare barrels, ammunition, cleaning kits, and supply of integrated fire-control systems for the battery.
The initial order will be for 72 guns with further potential orders for another 72. Delivery to begin by the end of 1947 if possible.

Japan could offer its Type 90 75mm AA Gun which is so reliable that it is also used as field gun and tank gun by the army (well, the gun is, not the mounts) and it is used on numerous warships as well (well, the gun is, not the mount).

I haven't really looked into the various types of guns for the IJA lately. Perhaps I should look into details for a modernized version of the Type 90 (which would be the one that is offered), a new 10cm gun type to replace the Type 14 10cm gun and maybe look at possibilities for the historical Type 3 12cm and Type 5 15cm guns as mobile mounts...

Schneider et Cie can offer the following 7.5cm and 10cm AA guns, both of which use the SADIR SFR-5M1 teledetecteur set and its associated fire-control system. Although the CA 75mm is in light production, Schneider is currently refitting the French Army's existing ordnance to the m.44 modification, so deliveries could be completed within four to six months of a signed purchase order. The CA 100mm is still in production; therefore delivery could be undertaken swiftly. For both offerings, spare parts are plentiful, as these are the two primary AA guns of the French military and some others.

Quoted

Canon CA 75mm Mle1939 m.44 (Schneider)
Caliber: 75x518R mm
Barrel length: 4000 mm (3250 mm rifling)
Battle-station weight : 3250 kg
Rate of fire: 20 rpm
Muzzle velocity: 700 m/s
Traverse: 360°
Elevation: 0° to +90°
Maximum range: 8000 m with proximity fuse
Fire-Control: 5x power panoramic telescope with 14° view; Mle.44 Integrated Gunnery Data Computer and Director
Radar: SADIR SFR-5M1

Quoted

Canon CA 100mm Mle1943 (Schneider)
Caliber: 100x700R
Barrel length: 5740 mm
Battle-station weight: 11,000 kg
Rate of fire: 10 rpm
Muzzle velocity: 960 m/s (projectile of 15.9kg)
Traverse: 360°
Elevation: -3° to 89°
Maximum range: 15000 m with proximity fuse
Fire-Control: 5x power panoramic telescope with 14° view; Mle.44 Integrated Gunnery Data Computer and Director
Radar: SADIR SFR-5M1

Schneider additionally has designs and initial prototypes for an anti-aircraft weapon of 130mm caliber. At the present time this design is not in production or active service nor is it proposed for demonstration, since AA guns of larger than 10cm are not deemed "reasonably mobile" weapons as requested by the spec.

Cockerill offers their 90mm 90L50 gun in partnership with Phillips.


90mm 90L50 Cockerill
Entered service in 1940, is fitted with a semi-automatic spring ramming breach. Built in both ground and sea variants.
Calibre: 90mm
Barrel length: 4.8m
Weight, traveling: 8,800kg
Weight, in action: 6,750kg
Elevation: -0° to +85°
Traverse: 360°
Muzzle Velocity: 835m/s
Shell weight: 10.0kg
Rate of fire: 20-25rpm
Maximum ceiling: 11,300m
Maximum horizontal: 16,000m

Fire-control equipment will consists of a Philips radar set and predictors etc. as used by the standard Dutch and Belgian army equipment.

Atlantis can offer the following (edited: I didn't realize when I posted this was an army tender and as these are naval versions, the land versions will have half the ROF posted)

Atlantean 2.95" AA mount
Caliber: 75mm
Barrel length: 3810 mm
Weight of mount : twin mount 15.7 tons, single mount 8.5 tons
Rate of fire: 40 rpm
Muzzle velocity: 820 m/s
Weight of round: 24lbs (10.9kg)
Traverse: 360°
Traverse rate: 25 degrees per second
Elevation: 0° to +85°
Elevation rate: 30° per second
Maximum range: 12000 m @ 45°
Fire-Control: Peep-site and Optical telescope
Crew: 11 men for twin, one mount captain, two control station men, four shellmen and four shell passers. Crew for single mount is 6, one mount captain, one control station man, two shellmen and two shell passers

Atlantean 3.95" DP mount
Caliber: 100mm
Barrel length: 4500 mm
Weight of mount : twin mount 18.5 tons, single mount 10.2 tons
Rate of fire: 15-20 rpm
Muzzle velocity: 810 m/s
Weight of round: HE 35lbs (15.8kg) SAP 38lbs 17.3 kg
Traverse: 340°
Traverse rate: 20 degrees per second
Elevation: 0° to +85°
Elevation rate: 20° per second
Maximum range: 18100 m @ 45°
AA range at 85° 11,890 m
Fire-Control: Optical telescope with gunnery computer and director
Crew: 9 men for twin, one mount captain, two control station men, two shellmen and four shell passers. Crew for single mount is 5, one mount captain, one control station man, one shellmen and two shell passers

The firm of Rheinmetall-Borsig submits the 8.8cm Flak 43 for consideration. Deliveries of the standard gun and associated fire control equipment can commence within six months of an order being placed; if self-propelled mountings are desired, the first units can be delivered within nine-months of placement of the procurement.

Quoted

This weapon was developed as a second-generation medium calibre anti-aircraft gun to supplant the first-generation 8.8cm FlaK33. It features a lower silhouette on its turntable mounting compared with its predecessors. The barrel is in two-sections with an overall length of 72 calibres. The design parent is Rheinmetall-Borsig. Low-rate production began in 1945.

The FlaK 43 can be directed by the Funk-Messgerät FuMG 62 under centralised battery control or it may be controlled locally. The Hanomag firm has developed a self-propelled mounting for the weapon as a private venture; and while this variant has not been adopted by either the Heer or Luftwaffe, the vehicle is available for export.

Calibre: 8.8 cm L/72
Length: 6.545 m
Weight: 7,800 kg
Breech: horizontal semi-automatic sliding block, electrically fired
Elevation: -3° to +90°
Traverse: 360° Rate of fire: 20 rounds/minute
Muzzle velocity: 1,000 metres/second
Effective ceiling: 11,300 metres (15,000 metres maximum)
Effective range: 19,735 metres
Shell Weight: 9.40 kg

Bruce, could you also put the specs in the text of the post, rather than just the image? That way if the link to the image is ever broken, the data itself isn't lost...

Quoted from "Brockpaine"

Bruce, could you also put the specs in the text of the post, rather than just the image? That way if the link to the image is ever broken, the data itself isn't lost...

Like so? <points up> ^^

Eyup, thanks!

Vickers will offer the Ordnance QF 3.7in Mk IV.
This is the latest mobile version of this gun which first entered service in 1937 which was introduced in 1941 with totally new ancillary equipment, automatic fuze setter and automatic loader.
Weight in action: 9.2 tons
Effective ceiling: 32-45,000 feet
Ground range: 20,600-25,600 yards
Rate of fire: 25 rpm.
Elevation: 0-85 degrees
It is offered with a modernised Gun Laying Radar Mk II, a 10cm wavelength set designed for controlling 3.7in AA guns in 1942. The modernised set would be lighter and more compact with a new aerial based on more recent British designs.

After consideration of all offers the Ministry of Defence announces the winner of the tender as Rheinmetall-Borsig. An order will be placed for 72 FlaK 43 and 16 FuMG 62 to be fulfilled by the end of the year. A repeat order for identical quantities is likely for next year.

It was a close competition, Cockerill coming very close second with the 90L50. Schneider's entries were also rated highly favourably.
Generally it was found that the 90mm+ guns were too heavy and did not offer a competitive advantage in performance to compensate. At the other end, the 75mm guns were generally lighter and more mobile but had inferior performance to the 80-90mm range which offered the best mix of performance and mobility and sophisticated fire-control. Lastly, the age of some of the entries was surprising to the Ministry though that mattered less when an older gun was paired with effective and modern electronic fire-control systems.

Dang! Not even had any time to look into other possible existing Japanese guns.

Not so sure about the German one. While the stats appear to be nice, I would think that barrel life is going to be a serious issue compared to that of the other entries due to the high rate of fire and high muzzle velocity.

Quoted

Lastly, the age of some of the entries was surprising to the Ministry though that mattered less when an older gun was paired with effective and modern electronic fire-control systems.

Unlike Microscum that comes out with a new operating system every few years in order to suck you dry of your hard earned cash, I would think that the armies are more looking at improving and upgrading stuff that works.

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Not so sure about the German one. While the stats appear to be nice, I would think that barrel life is going to be a serious issue compared to that of the other entries due to the high rate of fire and high muzzle velocity.

This is likely to be true - and it is as true for any other gun with comparable performance. It is part of the price that has to be accepted to get that many shells into the air at the height specified. One of the reasons the barrel is in two sections is to facilitate replacement. It is a higher-cost weapons system for protection of high-value targets likely to be attacked.

I had serious doubts whether even upgraded guns from 1930-1940 designed for dealing with relatively slow early monoplane bombers can deal with modern threats from fast twin-engine bombers like the Mosquito and I.A.e.28 and high altitude heavy bombers like the B-29 and with jet-powered bombers only a few years away the whole situation has changed.
Ideally if Argentina was a Great Power they would be looking at some form of SAM development programme but they are not and such technology is still at least 5-10 years away from perfection. So for now Argentina is sticking to guns and buying the best it can.

Also, I know some players have qualms about buying from themselves, I generally don't mind buying from myself if I think I have the best product on offer. However Argentina has ordered a several items of British kit lately in one form or another (though Argentina has always brought widely - Atlantis, Japan, Chile, Germany, Italy, Britain) and I didn't feel able to go for the Cockerill gun which I think might be slightly superior as a gun but slightly inferior in terms of radar FC. Also, the Germans have a foothold with the Army top brass with other solid purchases, especially in artillery, and that counts for something too.