WesWorld

Some months ago, I received a request for assistance from another player on the question of turning an existing whale factory ship into a very large landing craft carrier to support amphibious operations. As the Philippines actually has four such whale factory ships tied up doing nothing, and a Springsharp on file, doing so as an example was not difficult at all.

This is certainly not a design the Philippines would seriously contemplate; there is no need for it, and it is far too costly for its purse. I offer it as a “Could be”, if not a “Might have been”


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Orca, Philippine Landing Craft Carrier (Whale Factory) laid down 1929

Displacement: 20,559 t light; 21,050 t standard; 22,346 t normal; 23,383 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

535.01 ft / 535.01 ft x 75.00 ft x 29.99 ft (normal load) [163.07 m / 163.07 m x 22.86 m x 9.14 m]

Armament:

20 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (10x2 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1944 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, evenly spread, 4 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 26 lbs / 12 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 3,000

Armour:

Conning tower: 3.15" / 80 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 26,890 shp / 20,060 Kw = 20.43 kts
Range 15,000nm at 10.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,333 tons

Complement: 913 - 1,187

Cost: £3.352 million / $13.407 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 3 tons, 0.0 %
Armour: 54 tons, 0.2 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 54 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 826 tons, 3.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 12,076 tons, 54.0 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,787 tons, 8.0 %
Miscellaneous weights: 7,600 tons, 34.0 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 38,615 lbs / 17,516 Kg = 29,517.9 x 1.4 " / 35 mm shells or 4.5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.04
Metacentric height 3.5 ft / 1.1 m
Roll period: 16.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 42 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.00
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.52

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has raised forecastle, raised quarterdeck
Block coefficient: 0.650
Length to Beam Ratio: 7.13 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 23.13 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 45 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 23
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 31.99 ft / 9.75 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 25.98 ft / 7.92 m (18.01 ft / 5.49 m aft of break)
- Mid (50 %): 18.01 ft / 5.49 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 25.98 ft / 7.92 m (18.01 ft / 5.49 m before break)
- Stern: 25.98 ft / 7.92 m
- Average freeboard: 21.28 ft / 6.49 m
Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 50.4 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 115.5 %
Waterplane Area: 30,738 Square feet or 2,856 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 239 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 253 lbs/sq ft or 1,236 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 2.50
- Longitudinal: 4.22
- Overall: 2.63
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Breakdown of Miscellaneous Weight

Provision for Landing Craft Launch Ramp Aft - 200 tons
Provision for Cranes and Handling Gear for Landing Craft - 400 tons
Provision for Forty LCVP-type Landing Craft - 400 tons
Provision for Accommodation for LCVP crew and maintenance staff - 120+180 - 600 tons
Provision for Workshops for LCVP maintenance - 400 tons
Equipment storage - 5,000 tons
Weight reserve - 600 tons

Level 2 Minor Refit required to convert commercial hull to naval auxiliary

Cost: 3,084 tons
Time to Convert: 133 days

...different.

Can you point me to the original sim for comparison?

Never mind, found it.

Quoted from "The Rock Doctor"

Never mind, found it.

For some unknown reason they were built with armor to the conning tower and certain other naval features, paid for in game. No clue why... they are far too large for the Philippine Navy to make any use of.

Didn't Swamphen once say they were intended for conversion to seaplane base ships?

The original thread suggests oilers - which is weird because there's no reason he couldn't have just build oilers.

I suppose they could make adequate escort carriers, if one didn't mind having 20,000 t escort carriers.

Personally, I'd book a Type 2 drydock and scrap the lot of them.

Quoted from "Brockpaine"

Didn't Swamphen once say they were intended for conversion to seaplane base ships?

I vaguely recall him saying something like that when he dropped by here months back. I've actually got a Springsharp for such a conversion, but they are far too costly IMHO. Even a 15% conversion eats up more than 3,000 tons...

But if you have tonnage to burn, such a deal I can make for you...

Nah, I've got better things to waste money on.

Quoted

As the Philippines actually has four such whale factory ships tied up doing nothing

What? You're telling me that you are not sending them South every year in the hope that one day a bunch of idiots from some sort of "save the whales" organizations turn up so you can run them over with your 20,000 tons factory ships??

Frankly, I think that the most logical use for the hulls would be as large replenishment ships - they are designed for more than 7,000 tons of miscellaneous weight, and I suspect that more could be carved out of their bunkers. But they date to the days of SATSUMA's glory, and have no place in the Philippine Navy at the moment.

Quoted from "Rooijen10"

Quoted

As the Philippines actually has four such whale factory ships tied up doing nothing

What? You're telling me that you are not sending them South every year in the hope that one day a bunch of idiots from some sort of "save the whales" organizations turn up so you can run them over with your 20,000 tons factory ships??

Perhaps somebody will found Greenpeace early and I can sell them there - so both groups could play "Chicken" while the penguins watch and wait for a meal.

Why are these whale factory ships lying around when they could be out there earning the Philippine economy some serious hard cash?
[I dislike whaling too, and from a modern perspective such things are unacceptable, but from a 1940s viewpoint the provision of valuable fats is serious money in this period.]

Quoted from "Hood"

Why are these whale factory ships lying around when they could be out there earning the Philippine economy some serious hard cash?
[I dislike whaling too, and from a modern perspective such things are unacceptable, but from a 1940s viewpoint the provision of valuable fats is serious money in this period.]

Because Swamphen - I guess, since they date to his tenure - never bothered to create a whaling fleet, merely the factory ships. As for fats - they are not really an issue for the Philippines - different dietary requirements, alternative sources etc. (We like exporting coconut oil!). Since they were built with some naval tonnage (armor, engines) - I presume they were meant to be converted into auxiliaries at some point. But frankly, they are of no use to the Philippines.

I discussed with Brock how they could be sold in game - basically a percentage of the tonnage investment in them - which is quite small, compared to their SS tonnage. But unless you really need a huge auxiliary, they are not necessarily worth the cost of conversion.

Quoted

I dislike whaling too, and from a modern perspective such things are unacceptable, but from a 1940s viewpoint the provision of valuable fats is serious money in this period.

I look at it pretty much the same way. I don't like it (though I like eco-terrorism even less) but it is the way the world was back then (and a way of living for people), which is why I made a small piece of news about Japan's whaling fleet in 1943. I'll probably have to do some more about it and look around to see if I can find any data of period whaling ships to sim.

Quoted

Because Swamphen - I guess, since they date to his tenure - never bothered to create a whaling fleet, merely the factory ships.

I have seen you post various Merchant Designs so I am pretty sure you can do that as well for the other ships of the Filipino whaling fleet (I find it very hard to believe that those ships do not exist). It is just that only those factory ships were designed with possible future conversion in mind. Just because nothing is written about the Filipino Whaling Fleet or the other ships of the Filipino Whaling Fleet does not mean that they do not exist.

But if you don't want them, just give them to Japan's Whaling fleet. We shall properly use them.

Quoted from "Rooijen10"

Quoted

I dislike whaling too, and from a modern perspective such things are unacceptable, but from a 1940s viewpoint the provision of valuable fats is serious money in this period.

I look at it pretty much the same way. I don't like it (though I like eco-terrorism even less) but it is the way the world was back then (and a way of living for people), which is why I made a small piece of news about Japan's whaling fleet in 1943. I'll probably have to do some more about it and look around to see if I can find any data of period whaling ships to sim.

Quoted

Because Swamphen - I guess, since they date to his tenure - never bothered to create a whaling fleet, merely the factory ships.

I have seen you post various Merchant Designs so I am pretty sure you can do that as well for the other ships of the Filipino whaling fleet (I find it very hard to believe that those ships do not exist). It is just that only those factory ships were designed with possible future conversion in mind. Just because nothing is written about the Filipino Whaling Fleet or the other ships of the Filipino Whaling Fleet does not mean that they do not exist.

But if you don't want them, just give them to Japan's Whaling fleet. We shall properly use them.

Give? Surely you jest. Make me an offer...

Since you do not want them, I was actually expecting the Philippines to offer Japan something in order to get rid of those ships...