WesWorld

I'd been asked to fill in the gap between Harry leaving and me turning up with regards to Greece and the locals.

Harry had Greece and Turkey sitting out WW1 but in the meantime Atlantis has participated in a Gallipoli campaign, Turkey's been defeated and had her fleet interned. The fleet has been returned but Atlantis has secured a mandate around Constantinople (Istanbul). Other news in the Balkans is that Italy has gained a long section of coast in what was to be Yugoslavia. Further afield, Russia isn't Bolshi and Yugoslavia has been buying destroyers secondhand. To accomodate all these 'happenings' I'll propose a couple of changes but following is what Harry had;

1895) Offices and politicians secretly supporting the Cretan separatist movement against government wishes are discovered and purged with extreme prejudice. The 1897 Greco Turkish war over Crete is narrowly avoided.

1912)Albanian separatists commence insurrection against Turkey and within a few months are granted semi autonomy. Balkan states start discussions on how to take advantage of recent Turkish military setbacks. Greece asks the alliance members to postpone the planed operations against turkey until the following year so that they may have as many of their new ships operational as possible. This request is granted.

1913) The First Balkan war begins late October and lasts six weeks. Ottoman Turks are defeated, Bulgaria momentarily becomes the largest Balkan state and Albania declares independents.

1914) The Second Balkan war begins in June and a certain royal tourist decides it may not be a good idea for him or his wife to visit Sarajevo while the neighbouring nations are waging all out war. On the Serbian Bulgarian Front a young conscript is robed of his potential Fifteen minutes of fame and his legs by a non discriminating artillery shell, “such is life” The Second Balkan war ends within four weeks with the defeat of Bulgaria. In December Turkey receives its two new British built battle ships, the Reshadie and Sultan Osman the first. Due to the comprehensive destruction of their navy and heavy personnel losses during the First Balkan war, it takes a decade to properly crew them and build new escorts.
The only action seen by the Greek navy during the Second Balkan War was shore bombardment and transport of troops for the marine landings at Kilkis

1915) 2x Salamis super dreadnoughts are laid down in April. Ships built to counter the Reshadie and Sultan Osman.

Queen Olga removed from active duty and converted into accommodation hulk for the new Souda bay naval station.
1x Hydra class removed from active service and converted into accommodation hulk for Souda bay.
The hulk of the decommissioned King George sent to Souda bay to be used as a coal storage barge.
1x Floating dock also sent to Souda bay

1916) Word War One brakes out, Greeks and the Ottomans are happy to sit this one out.

1917) Construction on the Salamis class is suspended in November due to non-delivery of main gun turrets.
(Ships 65% complete) Turrets used by the British in their new battle cruiser class.

1919) Word War One ends in Allied victory on the 11 of March. England agrees on 20 of August to supply 14 inch barrels originally designed for Russia with new turrets for salamis class.

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Based on Harry's work and hooking in to Red Admiral's Italy and Wes's Atlantis, I'll assume that Greece picked up Crete in 1913 during the 1st Balkan War as there is activity at the new base in Souda Bay (Suda Bay) on Crete in 1915.

The change I'll make is that in 1916 Greece was bought by the Entente in the same way as Italy, a 1917 secret 'Treaty of London' promises Italy large sections of the Adriatic coast. Albania is to be divided between Italy, Serbia and Greece. Serbia is promised Bosnia, Croatia etc. Greece is offered Thrace, Macedonia, part of Albania, Anatolia (Izmir region of Turkey) and Cyprus from Great Britain. Italy is also offered part of Turkey across from the Dodecanese Islands that she had taken in 1912.

When the war is over in 1919, Italy, Greece and Serbia take control of the areas outlined in the 1917 treaty. The Sultan signs a peace treaty but Turkey decends into revolution. GB hands over Cyprus (upsetting the local Turks) and supports the Greek/ Italian move into Asia Minor. The revolution continues with the Italians and Greeks holding off the Turks. A new agreement is reached, Atlantis secures a mandate around Constantanople - thwarting the Pan-Greeks who wanted to gain the area. Greece and Italy reach agreement on Balkan issues and Italy hands over the Dodecanese Islands and the section of Asia Minor to Greece. In a settlement with the Turks, Greece withdraws from the former Italian section and agrees to a plebicite in Anatolia and Cyprus in 1925. Atlantis returns the interned Turkish Fleet.

The Balkans/ Eatsern Med now look something like this;



Thoughts?

Cheers,

Sounds interesting and good to me even though I´m not sure if a WW1 lasting until 11 march 1919 will fit all others timelines.

...we really should consider making Turkey a player nation, if/when more players are added, IMHO.

Top 5 needing players (my opinions only ) -
1. Turkey
2. Chile
3. China
4. Romania
5. Bulgaria

Surprises me that you did not put Switserland in that list. :-)

Replace China with Nordmark and you have it right IMO.
I've gone down this road before though and I don't
expect any new player nations to be granted.

As for the sequence of events them seem very logical, allthough the extended WW1 wouldn't have to include all nations to work.

I figured Nordmark ranked above all of those.

As far as I can tell, Turkey and Chile are the only dreadnought-equipped navies not represented here*, so I thought that if any new nations were added, they would be the ones.

(* - Aside from Argentina and Brazil, of course, but did Nordmark achieve their goal of removing said dreadnoughts? The world wonders...)

Well, I thought that the list was for non player nations needing a player.

Then do you need more players?

I as yet have very little understanding of how this sim functions, but I would be willing to give it a try.

hmm. as we have found out, qualified players are hard to come by. I would suggest filling the nordmark gap and take it from there. Also we have existing players. GC, fancy another nation? *g*

I got to thinking that despite my initial assertion, perhaps it would be best if someone else took over Nordmark - Peng only posted his ships down to CLs, and I hate simming destroyers...!

Now, if y'all want to add Chile to the sim, you know where to reach me.

I'd be willing to participate, if there was an opening, and if someone would bring me up to speed on how to play.

From the map I've found, there appears to be a major hole in activity in South America (which seems to have been a sight for a small war for Nordmark, but that hasn't materialized). There are also minor counties (in terms or size or naval ability) in Asia and Europe.

I seem to recall there being 13 player treaty nations at this time, plus I think two non-treaty player nations. Nordmark seems to be the largest MIA at this time.

Any suggestions from the players? Where would they like to see another country (treated or non-treatied)?

Is there an updated map that one can zoom in on? The words on the one I found here is too small to read the print in some places.

Well first off we'll have to start a new thread reguarding new players, as poor Alt has had his alt history thread highjacked!

The change in Balkan history is okay with me. The presence of a Serbian coastline, and an Italian enclave south of Tirane, combine to keep the area lively in the future.

As for WW1, I'd prefer to stick with the 1918 end, as Germany's political evolution depended on pre-1921 happening essentially as historical. That doesn't mean that things in the Balkans can't drag on for a few more months, though.

One day we'll need to agree on what exactly happened in WW1...

"One day we'll need to agree on what exactly happened in WW1..."

Incredibly difficult to do! Perhaps another thread to discuss each nations participation.

I didn't notice the full extent of the situation in the Far East. I knew there was Japan, India, Phillapines, and Austrailia along with British, French, Dutch, and Iberian colonies....I didn't know about Danish Siam. (how did that happen?)

The Pacific is a big place, and one needs a long ranged navy to cover all those islands. But is the United States is more or less sitting on the side lines (as there is no Phillapines to guard) who will be the antagonist that sets Japan off? (of that needs to happen). That combined South American Nation could be a problem if they decide to expand into the Pacific as the Atlanic seems a bit full at the moment. Of course they have issues closer to home.

Would Mexico join (voluntarily or through force) a South American Alliance?

I seem to be caught up in South America for some reason. Maybe its because I like what alt naval is doing with the Hispanic Federation (primary reason I'm here I think). I don't know what is best, or even wise at this time.

I think I'm forgetting something, but maybe it wasn't meant for this thread.

Ithekro, Pm me with any questions you have about the SIM, I can fill you in on the world situation as well.

Hijack!

Arrrgh - I've had a week of spyware seige and been on the verge of rebuilding the system : ( - there are some nasty ones about.

Anyway, it seems that this thread has been a catalyst for a few other things so that is good. I'll wait to hear Red Admiral's view on this map as it affects him the most.

Cheers,

I'd also prefer the war to be over in 1918 at the historic date - everything else just seems too much rebuilding to me ....

kick IE into the bucket - it's too open. use Opera or Mozilla or something ...

Well either date of the war ending, the other question that goes with that one, is when does it start, and how? I've seen 1914 and 1916 here.

If the war starts nearly two years late, then a four or so month late ending wouldn't be too far off. This would also explain why Germany is better off in this timeline, even against larger numbers of enemies.

I assume the Ottoman Empire is gone, and the Middle East is under colonial/protectorate controls. Syria is very clearly labeled as French, and a few other locations are colored in on the map. How much of this is British, Independent, or under others imperial control? Trans-Jordan and Palastine for instance? Depending on how the breakup of Ottoman terriories is handled, the (real) problems of that region today could be avoided, though likely not without consequences.

Depending on how the Great War went, and who promised who what, and if anything horrible happen in the 1940s in Poland and Germany, there might never be an Israel in Wesworld. There are positives and negatives there (especially depending on who you ask). There are other issues involving the Middle East the are rooted in the breaking up of the Ottoman Empire. I assume someone has, or is looking into those for there stories?