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1

Friday, August 17th 2007, 1:05pm

A first try ....

What are you thinking about the following design ???

Design A laid down 1932

Displacement:
12.199 t light; 13.241 t standard; 16.200 t normal; 18.567 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
604,35 ft / 596,13 ft x 70,87 ft x 24,28 ft (normal load)
184,21 m / 181,70 m x 21,60 m x 7,40 m

Armament:
6 - 11,02" / 280 mm guns (2x3 guns), 669,80lbs / 303,81kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
6 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 20,79lbs / 9,43kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
8 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1932 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
10 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1932 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 4.982 lbs / 2.260 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 250
8 - 21,0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 4,13" / 105 mm 413,39 ft / 126,00 m 11,48 ft / 3,50 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 107% of normal length
Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
3,94" / 100 mm 328,08 ft / 100,00 m 22,31 ft / 6,80 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 5,51" / 140 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 3,94" / 100 mm
2nd: 0,39" / 10 mm - -

- Armour deck: 1,61" / 41 mm, Conning tower: 3,15" / 80 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 3 shafts, 74.515 shp / 55.588 Kw = 28,50 kts
Range 8.900nm at 20,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 5.326 tons

Complement:
717 - 933

Cost:
£5,718 million / $22,873 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 623 tons, 3,8%
Armour: 3.185 tons, 19,7%
- Belts: 823 tons, 5,1%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 1.066 tons, 6,6%
- Armament: 370 tons, 2,3%
- Armour Deck: 883 tons, 5,4%
- Conning Tower: 43 tons, 0,3%
Machinery: 2.199 tons, 13,6%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 5.842 tons, 36,1%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 4.001 tons, 24,7%
Miscellaneous weights: 350 tons, 2,2%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
21.718 lbs / 9.851 Kg = 32,4 x 11,0 " / 280 mm shells or 3,6 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,24
Metacentric height 4,4 ft / 1,4 m
Roll period: 14,1 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 65 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,53
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,08

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
Block coefficient: 0,553
Length to Beam Ratio: 8,41 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,42 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 60
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 17,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26,90 ft / 8,20 m
- Forecastle (20%): 17,09 ft / 5,21 m
- Mid (50%): 17,09 ft / 5,21 m
- Quarterdeck (15%): 17,09 ft / 5,21 m
- Stern: 17,09 ft / 5,21 m
- Average freeboard: 17,88 ft / 5,45 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 109,6%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 116,7%
Waterplane Area: 29.561 Square feet or 2.746 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 125%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 132 lbs/sq ft or 646 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1,01
- Longitudinal: 1,35
- Overall: 1,04
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

2

Friday, August 17th 2007, 1:20pm

as a Panzerschiffe, she seems ok but those 88's probably want to be Dual Purpose, and I'd reduce the Torpedo Bulkhead to 2inches max, and add a little more deck armour.

3

Friday, August 17th 2007, 1:33pm

What he said. And some more turret armor would be good too. With just two turrets you can't risk easily losing one.

Otherwise looks good for a panzerschiffe. The problem with the PS is that I think is a worthless concept. Too much gun for a paper armor hull...

4

Friday, August 17th 2007, 1:48pm

The historical panzerschiffe were a design for a particular moment in time, when that moment passed, their value started heading downhill.

In the case of the design, assuming a panzerschiffe role, I'd ditch the torpedo bulkhead entirely (with those main guns and that beam, there's probably not room for it anyway) and use the weight saved on more speed and more armor. You probably don't need 250 rounds for each main gun, either.

5

Friday, August 17th 2007, 2:02pm

Agreed, 180 rounds per gun should be more than enough. Shes got a decent speed so removing the torpedo bulkhead should give you some room to improve her sea keeping or armor.

6

Friday, August 17th 2007, 2:08pm

This problem has however each ship, which possesses "only" 2 main guns. Loosing one gun means loosing 50% of firepower. That's why the pocket battle ship should be "Faster than the stronger ones and stronger than the faster ones".
I would not call this concept worthless. I think for a smaller navy it's already a good solution. A pocket battle ship connects representative tasks with a certain strength.

PS:
The Richillieu and the Dunkerque were built at that time, only due to the being of the pocket battle ships.

7

Friday, August 17th 2007, 2:19pm

Better ?

Design A2:

Displacement:
12.997 t light; 13.845 t standard; 16.557 t normal; 18.726 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
605,92 ft / 596,13 ft x 70,87 ft x 24,28 ft (normal load)
184,68 m / 181,70 m x 21,60 m x 7,40 m

Armament:
6 - 11,02" / 280 mm guns (2x3 guns), 669,80lbs / 303,82kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns in single mounts, 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
6 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 20,79lbs / 9,43kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
8 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1932 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
10 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1932 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 4.982 lbs / 2.260 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 180
8 - 21,0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 4,33" / 110 mm 381,56 ft / 116,30 m 11,48 ft / 3,50 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 98% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 7,09" / 180 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 3,94" / 100 mm
2nd: 0,39" / 10 mm - -

- Armour deck: 2,56" / 65 mm, Conning tower: 3,15" / 80 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 3 shafts, 95.990 shp / 71.609 Kw = 30,20 kts
Range 8.000nm at 20,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 4.881 tons

Complement:
729 - 948

Cost:
£6,249 million / $24,994 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 623 tons, 3,8%
Armour: 2.749 tons, 16,6%
- Belts: 807 tons, 4,9%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
- Armament: 482 tons, 2,9%
- Armour Deck: 1.416 tons, 8,5%
- Conning Tower: 44 tons, 0,3%
Machinery: 2.833 tons, 17,1%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 6.592 tons, 39,8%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3.559 tons, 21,5%
Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 1,2%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
23.211 lbs / 10.528 Kg = 34,7 x 11,0 " / 280 mm shells or 2,3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,11
Metacentric height 3,7 ft / 1,1 m
Roll period: 15,6 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 78 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,96
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,36

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak, low quarterdeck
Block coefficient: 0,565
Length to Beam Ratio: 8,41 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,42 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 57
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 20,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26,90 ft / 8,20 m
- Forecastle (18%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Mid (50%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15%): 23,62 ft / 7,20 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m before break)
- Stern: 23,62 ft / 7,20 m
- Average freeboard: 25,32 ft / 7,72 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 87,0%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 172,6%
Waterplane Area: 29.900 Square feet or 2.778 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 122%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 133 lbs/sq ft or 651 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,92
- Longitudinal: 2,26
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

8

Friday, August 17th 2007, 2:26pm

The Swedish Sverige class of coastdefence ships when designed in 1910 to 1912 was also designed "Faster than the stronger ones and stronger than the faster ones". Only 2 mainguns less than the panzerschiff.

Since Swedens navy was a coastdefence navy they traded in range for speed and protection.

In Swedens naval staffs during the 20s and early 30s
they said that 3 Sverige ships could offer battle to 2 Soviet Marat ships, the Soviet Union was the primary foe back then, Germany only became a bogeyman
9/4-1940.

But for a small navy the panzershiff is a valid design. I would in your design parador traded in range and torpedobulkheads for more protection and seakeeping. But a coastdefence ship you can also trade in some seakeeping because they are not bluewater ships olnly brown and greenwaterships.

You only need very long range if your ship is designed as a raider.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "Johan" (Aug 17th 2007, 2:27pm)


9

Friday, August 17th 2007, 3:32pm

Just for fun how about arranging the seconadry's into 4 twin turrets instead of eight singles?

10

Friday, August 17th 2007, 3:33pm

Quoted

Otherwise looks good for a panzerschiffe. The problem with the PS is that I think is a worthless concept. Too much gun for a paper armor hull...
Yet a PS (Scheer) has the record for most tonnage sunk by a surface warship. They where flawed but I still consider them the most effective surface warships ever built.

11

Friday, August 17th 2007, 5:16pm

@ thes:
Tell me the benefit, arranging the secondary's into 4 twin turrets instead of 8 single turrets.
With 8 turrets i can split the fire very well to many merchants ;-)

@desert:
That is also the reason why a fleet of pocket battle ships would be better, than two or three large battle ships. See the past .... six or eight more Scheer's and no Scharnhorst, Gneisenau, Bismarck and Tirpitz.

Kaiser Kirk

Lightbringer and former European Imperialist

  • Send private message

12

Friday, August 17th 2007, 5:39pm

Overall fairly decent. Speed is now higher than most wesworld capital ships, but while deck armor is acceptable, belt armor and speed is less than that of a wesworld heavy cruiser- which also run about 13,000 tons. Frankly, I'd expect one of those CAs to have a reasonable chance vs. this ship.

From one of the Navweapons articles, I have the notion that 3 shafts seems like a poor arrangement.
I also dislike high cruise speeds, as you increase your average fuel consumption, and thus the burden on your supply infrastructure.

13

Friday, August 17th 2007, 8:06pm

Quoted

Originally posted by Desertfox

Quoted

Otherwise looks good for a panzerschiffe. The problem with the PS is that I think is a worthless concept. Too much gun for a paper armor hull...
Yet a PS (Scheer) has the record for most tonnage sunk by a surface warship. They where flawed but I still consider them the most effective surface warships ever built.


I used to think that the most tonnage sunk record belonged to Pinguin (150k tons or so)...how much tonnage did Scheer send to the bottom?.

Adm. Scheer achieved nothing a ship with similar range, eight 8'' guns, better speed and balanced armor could not achieve or surpass. It was perfectly feasible to achieve those features within similar displacements. I think

The panzerschiffen were a political success, a notable engineering feat, and Germany needed them just because of political reasons.

But as warships, forgetting political considerations, and taking their actual value as fighting units, I never thought too much of them. They were cruisers with out-of-proportion main weapons, barely enough armor to fight against CLs, and lacking speed: PSs rarely were good for more than 26 knots.

besides, their "ability" to outfight everything they couldnt outrun, and outrun everything they couldn't outfight was a farce because Hood, Renown and Repulse could all of them catch a PS and blow it to bits...and because it was proben that a single PS couldn't outfight three enemy not-exactly-the-best cruisers.

As surface raiders were effective, yes. But they could've been even better, and equally efective, for that role with 8 inch guns (or even smaller). As I said, you don't need 11'' guns to crush a merchant and be a good raider...

You don't even need a warship for that role as Atlantis, Komet , Kormoran, Orion, etc... probed. But if you go for a warship, at least build a balanced one...

my thoughts, at least.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "RAM" (Aug 17th 2007, 8:08pm)


14

Friday, August 17th 2007, 10:49pm

I'll take an Oyama over a Scheer. Sure you could probably build two Scheers for an Oyama, but Oyama and her 9 x 10" guns can run circles around Scheer and is armored to take on real cruisers. She won't stop a shell from Scheer, but Scheer won't stop a shell from Oyama either. Also Oyama can run from British Battlecruisers.

15

Saturday, August 18th 2007, 1:36am

Since i was thinking along the same lines as parador I figured may as well put this in his post instead of making a new one. I went a little heavier on the armor and since at best it will be Q1 of 36 b4 i got a country i went with 1936 as the build year

XS-36, Heavy Cruiser laid down 1936

Displacement:
10,992 t light; 11,660 t standard; 13,000 t normal; 14,072 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
606.73 ft / 600.00 ft x 61.65 ft (Bulges 71.65 ft) x 22.00 ft (normal load)
184.93 m / 182.88 m x 18.79 m (Bulges 21.84 m) x 6.71 m

Armament:
6 - 11.00" / 279 mm guns (2x3 guns), 665.50lbs / 301.87kg shells, 1936 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
12 - 5.00" / 127 mm guns (6x2 guns), 62.50lbs / 28.35kg shells, 1936 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
32 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns (8x4 guns), 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1936 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side ends, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 0.50" / 12.7 mm guns (4x4 guns), 0.06lbs / 0.03kg shells, 1936 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, all amidships
Weight of broadside 4,746 lbs / 2,153 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5.00" / 127 mm 390.00 ft / 118.87 m 9.42 ft / 2.87 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 100 % of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 6.00" / 152 mm 2.00" / 51 mm 6.00" / 152 mm
2nd: 2.00" / 51 mm 1.00" / 25 mm -
3rd: 0.50" / 13 mm - -
4th: 0.50" / 13 mm - -

- Armour deck: 4.00" / 102 mm, Conning tower: 2.00" / 51 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 66,538 shp / 49,638 Kw = 30.00 kts
Range 10,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 2,411 tons

Complement:
608 - 791

Cost:
£6.034 million / $24.137 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 593 tons, 4.6 %
Armour: 3,136 tons, 24.1 %
- Belts: 766 tons, 5.9 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 483 tons, 3.7 %
- Armour Deck: 1,864 tons, 14.3 %
- Conning Tower: 24 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 1,867 tons, 14.4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 5,352 tons, 41.2 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,008 tons, 15.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 43 tons, 0.3 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
16,110 lbs / 7,307 Kg = 24.2 x 11.0 " / 279 mm shells or 2.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
Metacentric height 3.0 ft / 0.9 m
Roll period: 17.4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.62
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.07

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.481
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.37 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 28.43 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 54 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 65
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 9.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 2.46 ft / 0.75 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26.94 ft / 8.21 m
- Forecastle (18 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Mid (50 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Quarterdeck (18 %): 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Stern: 17.15 ft / 5.23 m
- Average freeboard: 17.84 ft / 5.44 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 82.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 135.3 %
Waterplane Area: 25,187 Square feet or 2,340 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 111 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 134 lbs/sq ft or 653 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.96
- Longitudinal: 1.35
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

edited for minor armor changes, added light splinter shields to the quad .50 cal mounts

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Tanthalas" (Aug 18th 2007, 1:41am)


16

Saturday, August 18th 2007, 3:21pm

same here.

Quoted

I'll take an Oyama over a Scheer. Sure you could probably build two Scheers for an Oyama, but Oyama and her 9 x 10" guns can run circles around Scheer and is armored to take on real cruisers. She won't stop a shell from Scheer, but Scheer won't stop a shell from Oyama either. Also Oyama can run from British Battlecruisers.


Exactly. And 30.2 kts won't catch many WesWorld cruisers either.

A PB is too weakly armored to fight, and too slow to run from bigger preadators or to catch her intended prey.

(Jacky Fisher paraphrase intended )

17

Sunday, August 19th 2007, 11:33pm

Then I will sit down again to the drawing board and the plan will revise. And perhaps it becomes then nevertheless still another useful draft

18

Monday, August 20th 2007, 10:04am

Design A3

Displacement:
12.932 t light; 13.524 t standard; 15.795 t normal; 17.612 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
604,35 ft / 596,13 ft x 70,87 ft x 24,28 ft (normal load)
184,21 m / 181,70 m x 21,60 m x 7,40 m

Armament:
6 - 9,06" / 230 mm guns (2x3 guns), 371,24lbs / 168,39kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4,13" / 105 mm guns (4x2 guns), 35,32lbs / 16,02kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
6 - 3,46" / 88,0 mm guns in single mounts, 20,79lbs / 9,43kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
8 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1932 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
10 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1932 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 2.650 lbs / 1.202 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 180
8 - 21,0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5,12" / 130 mm 381,56 ft / 116,30 m 10,50 ft / 3,20 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 98% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 7,09" / 180 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 3,94" / 100 mm
2nd: 1,77" / 45 mm - -

- Armour deck: 3,94" / 100 mm, Conning tower: 2,56" / 65 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 3 shafts, 106.604 shp / 79.527 Kw = 31,30 kts
Range 12.000nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 4.088 tons

Complement:
703 - 915

Cost:
£5,324 million / $21,297 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 331 tons, 2,1%
Armour: 3.431 tons, 21,7%
- Belts: 871 tons, 5,5%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
- Armament: 400 tons, 2,5%
- Armour Deck: 2.125 tons, 13,5%
- Conning Tower: 35 tons, 0,2%
Machinery: 3.147 tons, 19,9%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 5.823 tons, 36,9%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.863 tons, 18,1%
Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 1,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
24.445 lbs / 11.088 Kg = 65,8 x 9,1 " / 230 mm shells or 2,4 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,21
Metacentric height 4,2 ft / 1,3 m
Roll period: 14,5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 67 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,44
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,34

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak, low quarterdeck
Block coefficient: 0,539
Length to Beam Ratio: 8,41 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24,42 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 59 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 17,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26,90 ft / 8,20 m
- Forecastle (18%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Mid (50%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15%): 23,62 ft / 7,20 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m before break)
- Stern: 23,62 ft / 7,20 m
- Average freeboard: 25,32 ft / 7,72 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 83,2%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 174,6%
Waterplane Area: 29.181 Square feet or 2.711 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 126%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 120 lbs/sq ft or 585 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,92
- Longitudinal: 2,17
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

19

Monday, August 20th 2007, 11:52am

For the size of the ship, the deck armor's probably heavier than necessary (and deck armor's very heavy). Also, there's probably little reason to ship both 105mm and 88mm guns, install 105mm guns in DP mounts and be happy. Given the intended speed, a transom stern will also be useful.

20

Monday, August 20th 2007, 12:05pm

Just like that ?

Design A4

Displacement:
12.930 t light; 13.521 t standard; 15.648 t normal; 17.351 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
585,00 ft / 576,77 ft x 68,24 ft x 24,28 ft (normal load)
178,31 m / 175,80 m x 20,80 m x 7,40 m

Armament:
6 - 9,06" / 230 mm guns (2x3 guns), 371,24lbs / 168,39kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
12 - 4,13" / 105 mm guns (6x2 guns), 35,32lbs / 16,02kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, all amidships
8 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm guns in single mounts, 1,55lbs / 0,70kg shells, 1932 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, 6 raised mounts
10 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm guns in single mounts, 0,24lbs / 0,11kg shells, 1932 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 2.666 lbs / 1.209 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 180
8 - 21,0" / 533 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 5,12" / 130 mm 381,56 ft / 116,30 m 10,50 ft / 3,20 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 102% of normal length

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 7,09" / 180 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 3,94" / 100 mm
2nd: 1,77" / 45 mm - -

- Armour deck: 3,15" / 80 mm, Conning tower: 2,56" / 65 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 3 shafts, 93.364 shp / 69.649 Kw = 31,30 kts
Range 12.000nm at 16,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3.830 tons

Complement:
699 - 909

Cost:
£5,083 million / $20,332 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 333 tons, 2,1%
Armour: 3.019 tons, 19,3%
- Belts: 867 tons, 5,5%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0,0%
- Armament: 413 tons, 2,6%
- Armour Deck: 1.704 tons, 10,9%
- Conning Tower: 34 tons, 0,2%
Machinery: 2.756 tons, 17,6%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 6.622 tons, 42,3%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2.719 tons, 17,4%
Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 1,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
25.960 lbs / 11.775 Kg = 69,9 x 9,1 " / 230 mm shells or 2,6 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,15
Metacentric height 3,7 ft / 1,1 m
Roll period: 15,0 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 63 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,51
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,26

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has rise forward of midbreak, low quarterdeck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,573
Length to Beam Ratio: 8,45 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 27,55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 61 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 17,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 26,90 ft / 8,20 m
- Forecastle (18%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m
- Mid (50%): 26,25 ft / 8,00 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15%): 23,62 ft / 7,20 m (24,61 ft / 7,50 m before break)
- Stern: 23,62 ft / 7,20 m
- Average freeboard: 25,32 ft / 7,72 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 76,1%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 174,1%
Waterplane Area: 29.240 Square feet or 2.717 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 137%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 137 lbs/sq ft or 670 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 1,08
- Longitudinal: 2,78
- Overall: 1,19
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is excellent
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily