WesWorld

Lighter weight is good though. Less strain on bridges and other infrastructure. Less ground pressure for crossing softer ground.

What is the point in the extra armour when thinner amounts can cope with the current 37-50mm anti-tank guns.

Looking at the historical Yugoslav tanks, the T-32 assault gun seems to be a pretty useful piece of kit. Small and light but reasonably armed.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral
Lighter weight is good though. Less strain on bridges and other infrastructure. Less ground pressure for crossing softer ground.

What is the point in the extra armour when thinner amounts can cope with the current 37-50mm anti-tank guns.

Exactly my point. I got no beef with the main armament, my beef if the excessive armor for the norm and the capabilities of the Yugoslavian Industry. I agree that someone could observe the current designs abroad and try to improve on them but the Yugoslavian industry will be press to produce this design in any major nuimbers, plus a 50mm armor should defeat the current AT guns in service.

the point was i wanted it to resist the 20mm hispanona or however its spelled, which is one of the guidlines in TS. as usual like everything I build in the Nverse it is over armored (my BBs may not be fast but you could spend a week trying to sink one).

as a former Marine im fond of over built equipment also im using a larger main gun than most atm (50.8 isnt alot biger but still) this was due to asthetics while I was drawing the vehicle (50.8mm is 2" even and the tank is at 2 pix = 1") its also 2" taller than anyone elses tanks (due to the 2" more ground clearance i gave it) The Irony is that from growing up around heavy equipment i tend to want to think in terms of a D6 when im specing out a tank and a D6 weighs 22 tons wet (thats with fuel oil all that in it, no i dont know where it all is i just know what a D6D weighd)

Theres a difference between being proof against the 20x110 when its fired directly outside the hull and when it's fired from 500-1000m away. At that range its penetrating around 10mm if at all.

Lots of penetration tables here if you navigate >>Intelligence >> Database of Penetration Data

The other thing to be aware of is that the rounds that TankSharp uses aren't necessarily the same as the ones that would have been available at this period.

If I recall the theory on U.S. Marines, they don't buy anything unless its proven, is built like a brick, and leaks oil like sieve.

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Originally posted by Ithekro
If I recall the theory on U.S. Marines, they don't buy anything unless its proven, is built like a brick, and leaks oil like sieve.

LOL so true, but the leaks oil thing is the whole Military

And as a former Marine I can tell you it will take years of development and testing to get this into the factory lines. I was stationed in Quantico by the Osprey van in 1991 ( I saw the crash over Pax River in 1991) and it took that bastards over a decade to get the damn thing right. We went to Gulf War I (1991) with M60 tanks while the Army got the M1's. We have to ask for the Tiger Brigade to upgrade our armored capabilities. Of course I say we but I really was sitting in Dhairan with a CH-53 squadron while the others got the glory.

My military career has being, except for my first duty station in Marine Barracks Mare Island, in the airwing or in the Higher echelon support levels. It takes a lot to build this and Yugoslavia doesn't have the resources or the experience in WW to build something like this, at least until a lot of trial and error.

For example Poland will not see the firsst gun armed 7TP tanks until middle 1936 and the 10TP until later that year. And that's after close to two years of development.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral


Looking at the historical Yugoslav tanks, the T-32 assault gun seems to be a pretty useful piece of kit. Small and light but reasonably armed.

Ahem, the T-32 was Czech, no Yugoslav tanks prior to the Tesko Vozilo Tip A (a T-34/85 modification)

yes but thats the glory of fiction ^.^ you can say Presto I developed it and as long as the story is good it works (ok not quite that fast but literaly you can take alot of liberty with development timeframes)

an example if I was planing on a 2" single turret on a ship would anyone even question it, no they might all point out that it is a tad on the small side but hey it works. realisticly the only diferance from a ship turret to a tank turret in this time period is armor weight and height, but thats just my take on it.

if I understand you right Per. you dont want Yugoslavia to build anything just like they didnt Historicly, well in my opinion id rather build my own stuff then when it fucks up (and trust me it will great for story line) I know who specificly to blame.

Hey, just play it like I did. Make an elaborate history from the end of the Great War to 1935 explaining the development of armored vehicles to get to the tank you want. Read India's encyclopedia.

For example make a history of your company since the end of the Great War in the Yugoslavian encyclopedia. The development first of a small quantity of armored cars followed by maybe a light tank and finishing with the current model. I will still bitch about the armor and the quantity of vehicles you could produce but if nothing against it in the storyline of WW so far and you post it it turns into reality. Or at least in WW.

My main concern is that tank growing out of thin air. Just show some kind of reasoning for it. And still will bitch about the quantity being produced.

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Originally posted by perdedor99
Hey, just play it like I did. Make an elaborate history from the end of the Great War to 1935 explaining the development of armored vehicles to get to the tank you want. Read India's encyclopedia.

For example make a history of your company since the end of the Great War in the Yugoslavian encyclopedia. The development first of a small quantity of armored cars followed by maybe a light tank and finishing with the current model. I will still bitch about the armor and the quantity of vehicles you could produce but if nothing against it in the storyline so far and you post it it turns into reality. Or at least in WW.

im actualy working on that (if I had goten hungary as well this is how i was planing to merge them) and trust me you will love the tests im going to post lol

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Originally posted by Tanthalas
as far as equivilant armor your right (its cause the whole thing is slopes and angles) but there isnt a single section that actualy has more than 65mm of armor. and the Panzer III had 75 in some locations

The 50.8mm gun isn't a big deal, as we've already had some time creep up to 55mm on the newest models.

But overall, ground equipment are supposed to be period, and I'm guessing 65mm armor is a little excessive for the period. Not by much- I've used the S-35's 55mm, but thats actually substantially less. So, just show the Real world tank that had 65mm armor in 1936.

As an aside, I believe it was Yugoslavia that was going to be obtaining the Dutch Lt-35 and G-1C, but first the border issues with Italy, and now this PRJ ruckus with Lithuania would scuttle that. So you're free of that baggage

Oh, on the D6- you mean the small CATs? Didn't know their weight, when I think CATs I think D8s or D7Hs .

a 6D is as large as an older 7, I have bene around 7's and 8's to but i know the wet weight on a 6D cause my dad owns one ^.^

oh and my precident for heavier armor. Right or Wrong was

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matilda_tank

Yup the Matilda

The matilda was about half the speed of this design and has a smaller gun too. Keep in mind with tanks, like battleships, there is a trade off relative to size. Armour, speed and firepower all have a cost.

...and to be honest I can't see Yugoslavia having a tank design better than most of the bigboys like Russia, France, Britain and Germany.

I'd say the Jaguar could lose some armour and still be a decent design with her speed and firepower, but that still wouldn't explain how they got such an exceptional design. You'll need to creat a developement process.

For example Atlantis started out mainly using the French FT-17 as a basis for its tank developement. Each follow on design has taken something from the preceeding design.

First the FT-17 clone the AT-17-AT-31-AT-32-AT-35. Same goes for its medium tanks, AT27-AT33-AT34. The light tanks had common weapons and suspension layouts, same with the Medium tanks. For me to create the AT-34 and 35 out of thin air would be quite dubious indeed, even for a heavily industrialized nation.

One also can look to Historical Germany. Sure they had versailles hampering their efforts but it wasn't untill the Panther that the Germans utilized sloping armour. meanwhile the British and Russian designers had already stumbled upon this idea. The first two German tank designs were inferior to their French and British counterparts.

It says alot about tank design of the period when the Somua S-35 was considered the best tank design of its era.

If the tank is being developed for 1937, the Maltilda's armor may be reasonable. As others are mentioning, a little odd for Yugoslavia. There is also the consideration that the Maltilda didn't have slopes and angles. Generally, mid 1930s tanks were slower, slab sided, clunky things that had flaws.

For Dutch progression we went FT-17s, to Carden-Lloyd tankettes, then Vickers 6-tons modified to our specs. Then we developed two tanks- the general purpose Skoda Lt-33 in partnership with the Filipinos, and the "heavy" Skoda Lt-35, meant for assault/counter assault in Verdun-style envrionments, and possessing a number of flaws which the Dutch deem merits.
I looked at the S-35 and then modified it and mixed with some other period tanks. It's slow, heavily armored with some questionable allocation choices, low PSI, uses heavy MGs instead of light and mid-caliber gun- 45mm.

im working on the back story (since I dont have old storied ships to write about and i havnt figured out my cast of charcters I have to write aobut somthing ^.^ ) belive it or not i plan to post the previous gen of tanks LOL all the way back to WW1 (I to planed to start with the FT1) but I wanted to get my curent tank hashed out b4 i did so that way I would have somthing to work backwards from.

Chile just buys other peoples tanks, or orders special types to deal with the climate (or altitude) of the region.

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Originally posted by Tanthalas
im working on the back story (since I dont have old storied ships to write about and i havnt figured out my cast of charcters I have to write aobut somthing ^.^ ) belive it or not i plan to post the previous gen of tanks LOL all the way back to WW1 (I to planed to start with the FT1) but I wanted to get my curent tank hashed out b4 i did so that way I would have somthing to work backwards from.

Why not have Eclipse develop the tank and let Yugoslavia buy the license?

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Originally posted by Vukovlad

Quoted

Originally posted by Tanthalas
im working on the back story (since I dont have old storied ships to write about and i havnt figured out my cast of charcters I have to write aobut somthing ^.^ ) belive it or not i plan to post the previous gen of tanks LOL all the way back to WW1 (I to planed to start with the FT1) but I wanted to get my curent tank hashed out b4 i did so that way I would have somthing to work backwards from.

Why not have Eclipse develop the tank and let Yugoslavia buy the license?

I could do that to i supose hadnt realy thought of it