WesWorld

Quoted from "Hood"

I note that in the Peru encyclopaedia Jefgte had planned six MS units for 1944 & 1945, MS5 to MS10, so I suspect MS7 is a cut and paste error/typo for MS8. I presume one was planned per Q so the last would complete in Q3/45.
http://wesworld.jk-clan.de/index.php?pag…9682#post129682

I'm happy with whatever changes you need to make to make things tally up. I would be inclined not to worry about the small 1944 errors of the order of 20 tons.

Occam's Razor suggests that this would be the case - the ship designated MS-7 should really be MS-8.

As I've previously mentioned, it 1Q45 is retconed, I do not wish to proceed with the pocket battleship and the escort carrier.

Yes, go ahead and redo the Q1/1945 report in order to get things taken care of correctly.

And now for the laundry-list of stuff I have still to figure out. I am hoping that perhaps The Rock Doctor can shed light on some of these.

1 - A Springsharp or other details of the transport Presidente Ramon Castilla - encyclopedia says details to follow.

2 - Is there a name for the second Consuela class tug?

3 - A Springsharp or other details on the L-1 class landing ship, the N-1 class netlayers, and the Y-1 class boom defense vessels.

4 - Ditto for the Biru-class coasters. I am rather interested in this sort of vessel.

5 - Clarification of the number of transports in service by name/type and details on the conversion of the transport Fernando to the depot ship Alpamayo.

The Peruvian encyclopedia, in the category "Gunboats, Escorts, and Sloops" lists several vessels whose continued existence appears doubtful

Quoted

Iquitos (1875)
Cahaupanas (1896)
Francisco Pizarro (1899)
America, Peruvian Amazon Flotilla Gunboat laid down 1903

Cusco (1906)
Puno
Requena
Oreliano

I think these date back to the mists of time (entries were made by thesmilingassassin) - anyone have ideas?

Quoted from "BruceDuncan"

3 - A Springsharp or other details on the L-1 class landing ship, the N-1 class netlayers, and the Y-1 class boom defense vessels.

Check the Indian or Persian encyclopedia. If memory serves, those were small craft laid down during Rocky's tenure, and I think he might have used the same tonnage for them as for one of the Persindian designs. (Again, I might be wrong - it's been at least a year or two since I seriously looked at what Peru had.)

Quoted from "Brockpaine"

Quoted from "BruceDuncan"

3 - A Springsharp or other details on the L-1 class landing ship, the N-1 class netlayers, and the Y-1 class boom defense vessels.

Check the Indian or Persian encyclopedia. If memory serves, those were small craft laid down during Rocky's tenure, and I think he might have used the same tonnage for them as for one of the Persindian designs. (Again, I might be wrong - it's been at least a year or two since I seriously looked at what Peru had.)

Tried that and came up empty or inconclusive. Some items I was able to find with certainty, the others are open to interpretation - hence the question. :(

I'll have a gander through my files and see what I have.

Quoted from "The Rock Doctor"

I'll have a gander through my files and see what I have.

I'd appreciate that Rocky. While some of the stuff I found in the Bharati encyclopedia might be correct, I want to make certain. And some of the Peruvian ships seem to have no direct Bharati parallels.

1/4. Having found my spreadsheet, it appears that President Ramon Castilla and Biru were to be identical conversions of civilian transports into military usage. 600 t was allocated for each job, implying a 2,400 t light displacement. I don't see any corresponding designs on my computer. So there'd be two transports in service. My suspicion is that I allocated a tonnage cost and intended to design the ship around it later - which appears not to have happened.

2 - Consuella class tug #2's name is Maria (per the 2/43 sim report).

3. The L-1 was a local design; strangely, I've got two 277 t designs but no 269 t designs. I'll post the v2 design after this and you can decided whether to trim it down eight tonnes, re-design, or find the 8t per unit in savings later on.

The N-1 harbour tug - not netlayer - is a copy of the Bharati Rajendra class. Other than swapping the 35 and 15 mm for 40 and 20 mm guns, the class should be identical, so I did not bother with a re-sim.

Y-1 are copies of the Bharati Shadi class, with 40 and 20 mm versus 35 and 15. The main gun was the same. Again, I did not re-sim for these minor changes.

4. See #1 above.

5. In respect of Fernando being converted into depot ship Alpamayo - my spreadsheet called for two conversions of 4,000 light displacement civilian ships into depot ships, at a cost of 1,000 t each. Unfortunately, this appears to have been another case of me allocating tonnage up front, intending to design the ship later, and never getting around to it. The 1944 sim reports do, however, capture the cost of both ships, although Jef's name choice for the second ship (Consuella) needs to be addressed unless you want two different Consuellas in service.

I have no information on the pre-1910 ships and probably assumed they'd been discarded by the time I took the helm.

This is the less-old LCI design I have. It's 8 t heavier than what I allocated in my spreadsheet and I don't know why.

Is this SS3 output? I kinda think it might be.

-----

Enter ship name, Enter country Enter ship type laid down 1941

Displacement:
277 t light; 284 t standard; 325 t normal; 358 t full load

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep)
(160.37 ft / 157.48 ft) x 22.97 ft x (5.25 / 5.68 ft)
(48.88 m / 48.00 m) x 7.00 m x (1.60 / 1.73 m)

Armament:
3 - 0.79" / 20.0 mm 45.0 cal guns - 0.25lbs / 0.11kg shells, 2,000 per gun
Anti-air guns in deck mounts, 1941 Model
2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck centre
1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck centre
Weight of broadside 1 lbs / 0 kg

Armour:
- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 0.59" / 15 mm - -

- Conning towers: Forward 0.59" / 15 mm, Aft 0.00" / 0 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Direct drive, 2 shafts, 700 shp / 522 Kw = 13.99 kts
Range 4,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 74 tons

Complement:
37 - 49

Cost:
£0.077 million / $0.306 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 0 tons, 0.1 %
- Guns: 0 tons, 0.1 %
Armour: 3 tons, 0.9 %
- Armament: 2 tons, 0.7 %
- Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 18 tons, 5.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 159 tons, 48.7 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 48 tons, 14.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 97 tons, 29.8 %
- Hull above water: 90 tons
- On freeboard deck: 7 tons

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
1,408 lbs / 639 Kg = 5,769.1 x 0.8 " / 20 mm shells or 1.1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.16
Metacentric height 0.7 ft / 0.2 m
Roll period: 11.3 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.00
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 2.00

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck,
a normal bow and a cruiser stern
Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0.600 / 0.610
Length to Beam Ratio: 6.86 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 12.55 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 25
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 10.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length):
Fore end, Aft end
- Forecastle: 20.00 %, 16.40 ft / 5.00 m, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m
- Forward deck: 30.00 %, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m
- Aft deck: 35.00 %, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m
- Quarter deck: 15.00 %, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m, 13.12 ft / 4.00 m
- Average freeboard: 13.39 ft / 4.08 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 50.2 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 178.7 %
Waterplane Area: 2,645 Square feet or 246 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 236 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 26 lbs/sq ft or 128 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.74
- Longitudinal: 13.68
- Overall: 1.00
Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space
Excellent accommodation and workspace room
Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

Thanks Rocky!

This is the sort of information I was hoping you might find. I probably will not make adjustments to the 1944 baseline I've worked up, though it explains some of the oddities I had to account for. I can now move forward with a sense of assurance.

Quoted

Is this SS3 output? I kinda think it might be.

Yes, it is.

A general question. Are there restrictions on Peruvian navigation on the Amazon? Historically Peru was able to sail warships to its river port Iquitos, in time of peace, of course. Would this be permitted in game?

I think at the close of the Peruvian Civil War there was a restriction against Peru moving military assets, including ships, into the Amazon basin. It's *possible* that restriction might've expired by this point, but that would best be answered by the Colombians...

I'd been contemplating building a few more "kits" of that patrol boat I re-assembled on Titicaca and assembling them at Iquitos, but I don't think I ever got around to it.

With regards to the restriction of Peruvian navigation on the Amazon, nothing was ever set in stone as Peru at that time was NPC but it was generally agreed between players in the region that Peru's navigation would be restricted to civilian transport only as a result of the Peruvians adventurism in Leticia. No time limit or details were given however. Colombia wished to push for territory across the river from Leticia and further extend the southern "foot' down to the Brazilian border near Estiron but without a player for Peru these demands got swept under the rug. Its tough to say if those Amazon restrictions would still be in place as it would 1) depend on relations between Peru/Colombia/Atlantis/Iberia/Chile and Brazil with emphasis on the first 4 nations and 2) what the involved players could come up with now. I suspect by this time only Peru and Colombia would care enough to concern themselves with borders or agreements involved with this conflict. Colombia wouldn't renew its demands to change borders now unless relations were terrible or another conflict flaired up.

Just to note -

In posts to the "Army" section of the Peruvian Encyclopedia, the first round will be an attempt to set a baseline and summarize where things stood, prior to 1945 or so; the second round will account for remedial activities covering 1945-46, and thereafter posts should be in synch with the rest of the game.