WesWorld

The Aguila class destroyers need to be brought up to date with radar and sonar; I propose to make some other modifications since the cost of them are covered by a Level 3 Refit. Here is the proposal:

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Aguila, Philippine Destroyer laid down 1938

Displacement: 1,581 t light; 1,660 t standard; 1,870 t normal; 2,038 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

392.17 ft / 367.45 ft x 33.46 ft x 14.01 ft (normal load) [119.53 m / 112.00 m x 10.20 m x 4.27 m]

Armament:

6 - 4.53" / 115 mm guns (3x2 guns), 46.40lbs / 21.05kg shells, 1938 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
8 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1938 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
6 - 0.54" / 13.7 mm guns (2x3 guns), 0.08lbs / 0.04kg shells, 1938 Model Breech loading guns in deck mounts on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 289 lbs / 131 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 250
4 - 24.0" / 610 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:

Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.59" / 15 mm 0.59" / 15 mm

Conning tower: 0.98" / 25 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 37,216 shp / 27,763 Kw = 34.00 kts
Range 5,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 378 tons

Complement: 141 - 184

Cost: £1.169 million / $4.678 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 36 tons, 1.9 %
Armour: 17 tons, 0.9 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 13 tons, 0.7 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 3 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 870 tons, 46.5 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 594 tons, 31.8 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 289 tons, 15.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 65 tons, 3.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 585 lbs / 265 Kg = 12.6 x 4.5 " / 115 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.29
Metacentric height 1.5 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 11.4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.47
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.08

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has a flush deck and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.380
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.98 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 22.07 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 64 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 48
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 25.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 22.97 ft / 7.00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
- Mid (50 %): 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
- Stern: 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 14.73 ft / 4.49 m

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 169.8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 104.1 %
Waterplane Area: 7,779 Square feet or 723 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 78 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 37 lbs/sq ft or 183 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.52
- Longitudinal: 2.02
- Overall: 0.60
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate

Breakdown of Miscellaneous weight:

Radar - 20 tons
Sonar - 20 tons
A/S outfit - four A/S mortars and two D/C racks - 25 tons

Refit Summary:

Level 3 Refit

Add Sonar
Add Radar
Modify armor of deck mounted guns
Modify conning tower armor
Reduce number of guns in tertiary battery
Changes to torpedo carriages, mine rails and depth charge racks/throwers
Refurbishment of internal fittings for life-extension purposes

Cost - 237 tons

Time to Execute - 48 days

I've probably missed this somewhere else, what A/S mortars are the Philippines using?
Generally a nice little refit and a very capable ship results with a blend of capabilities.

Quoted

Originally posted by Hood
I've probably missed this somewhere else, what A/S mortars are the Philippines using?
Generally a nice little refit and a very capable ship results with a blend of capabilities.

Standard sort of K-guns I presume; nothing too fancy. Down the road the Philippine Navy might want to acquire some sort of ahead-thrown-weapon for specialist A/S vessels, but not for this go round.

I've toyed with this design before but I think this is the definitive version, subject to comments.

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Poro, Philippine Light Cruiser laid down 1937

Displacement: 4,161 t light; 4,377 t standard; 4,862 t normal; 5,249 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

446.19 ft / 446.19 ft x 44.95 ft x 19.69 ft (normal load) [136.00 m / 136.00 m x 13.70 m x 6.00 m]

Armament:

12 - 4.53" / 115 mm guns (6x2 guns), 46.40lbs / 21.05kg shells, 1937 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on centreline ends, evenly spread, 3 raised

mounts - superfiring
24 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (6x4 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1937 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
Weight of broadside 588 lbs / 267 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 350
6 - 24.0" / 610 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:

Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 2.76" / 70 mm 354.33 ft / 108.00 m 7.97 ft / 2.43 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 122 % of normal length

Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 2.36" / 60 mm 2.36" / 60 mm -
2nd: 0.79" / 20 mm - -

Armour deck: 0.79" / 20 mm, Conning tower: 3.15" / 80 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 57,097 shp / 42,594 Kw = 33.00 kts
Range 6,500nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 872 tons

Complement: 290 - 378

Cost: £2.340 million / $9.359 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 74 tons, 1.5 %
Armour: 613 tons, 12.6 %
- Belts: 313 tons, 6.4 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 90 tons, 1.8 %
- Armour Deck: 191 tons, 3.9 %
- Conning Tower: 19 tons, 0.4 %
Machinery: 1,583 tons, 32.6 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 1,812 tons, 37.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 701 tons, 14.4 %
Miscellaneous weights: 80 tons, 1.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 3,721 lbs / 1,688 Kg = 80.2 x 4.5 " / 115 mm shells or 0.8 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.07
Metacentric height 1.7 ft / 0.5 m
Roll period: 14.4 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.54
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.21

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has rise forward of midbreak and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.431
Length to Beam Ratio: 9.93 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 24.33 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 59
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 0.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 29.53 ft / 9.00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 22.97 ft / 7.00 m
- Mid (50 %): 22.97 ft / 7.00 m (13.88 ft / 4.23 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 13.88 ft / 4.23 m
- Stern: 13.88 ft / 4.23 m
- Average freeboard: 18.95 ft / 5.78 m

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 120.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 113.5 %
Waterplane Area: 13,087 Square feet or 1,216 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 70 lbs/sq ft or 341 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.80
- Longitudinal: 2.75
- Overall: 0.90
Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is adequate
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform
Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

Breakdown of Miscellaneous Weight:

Radar - 50 tons - added during Refit
Reserved for future growth - 30 tons

Level 1 Refit: 5%

Radar added.

Refit cost: 208 tons
Refit time: 20 days

I've previously considered a much more extensive reconstruction but I have decided that it is not worth the cost. This is a much less ambitious refit.

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Ticao, Philippine Light Cruiser laid down 1935

Displacement: 5,523 t light; 5,875 t standard; 6,895 t normal; 7,710 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

562.83 ft / 556.00 ft x 56.00 ft x 16.99 ft (normal load) [171.55 m / 169.47 m x 17.07 m x 5.18 m]

Armament:

12 - 4.53" / 115 mm guns (6x2 guns), 46.40lbs / 21.05kg shells, 1935 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on centreline ends, evenly spread, 4 raised mounts - superfiring
16 - 2.95" / 75.0 mm guns (8x2 guns), 12.87lbs / 5.84kg shells, 1935 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on side ends, evenly spread, 4 raised mounts - superfiring
12 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (6x2 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1935 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, evenly spread
Weight of broadside 778 lbs / 353 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 450
8 - 24.0" / 610 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:

Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 2.99" / 76 mm 379.99 ft / 115.82 m 8.99 ft / 2.74 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 105 % of normal length

Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 2.99" / 76 mm 0.98" / 25 mm 2.01" / 51 mm
2nd: 2.01" / 51 mm 0.98" / 25 mm 2.01" / 51 mm
3rd: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.98" / 25 mm -

Armour deck: 1.42" / 36 mm, Conning tower: 2.76" / 70 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 3 shafts, 58,394 shp / 43,562 Kw = 32.00 kts
Range 11,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1,835 tons

Complement: 377 - 491

Cost: £2.583 million / $10.330 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 97 tons, 1.4 %
Armour: 1,098 tons, 15.9 %
- Belts: 421 tons, 6.1 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 111 tons, 1.6 %
- Armour Deck: 544 tons, 7.9 %
- Conning Tower: 22 tons, 0.3 %
Machinery: 1,659 tons, 24.1 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 2,569 tons, 37.3 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1,372 tons, 19.9 %
Miscellaneous weights: 100 tons, 1.5 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 9,066 lbs / 4,112 Kg = 195.4 x 4.5 " / 115 mm shells or 1.5 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.19
Metacentric height 2.9 ft / 0.9 m
Roll period: 13.8 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 71 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.26
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.04

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has a flush deck and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.456
Length to Beam Ratio: 9.93 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 27.07 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 56 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 68
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 15.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0.00 ft / 0.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 25.49 ft / 7.77 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 15.72 ft / 4.79 m
- Mid (50 %): 15.72 ft / 4.79 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 15.72 ft / 4.79 m
- Stern: 14.01 ft / 4.27 m
- Average freeboard: 16.37 ft / 4.99 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 93.4 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 126.5 %
Waterplane Area: 20,737 Square feet or 1,927 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 130 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 83 lbs/sq ft or 406 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.94
- Longitudinal: 1.06
- Overall: 0.96
Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Breakdown of miscellaneous weight:

Radar and associated directors -100 tons

Level 1 Refit:

Add radar
Remove 13.7mm machineguns

Cost - 276 tons

Time to execute - 22 days

The older Piquero class destroyers are in need of SLEP and armament upgrades to meet current needs.

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Piquero, Philippine Destroyer laid down 1931

Displacement: 1,569 t light; 1,633 t standard; 1,793 t normal; 1,920 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

365.92 ft / 352.69 ft x 35.27 ft x 12.30 ft (normal load) [111.53 m / 107.50 m x 10.75 m x 3.75 m]

Armament:

4 - 4.53" / 115 mm guns (2x2 guns), 46.40lbs / 21.05kg shells, 1944 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (2x4 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1944 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
2 - 0.54" / 13.7 mm guns in single mounts, 0.08lbs / 0.04kg shells, 1925 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
Weight of broadside 196 lbs / 89 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 250
4 - 24.0" / 610 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 0.98" / 25 mm 0.59" / 15 mm -
2nd: 0.59" / 15 mm - -
3rd: 0.39" / 10 mm - -

Conning tower: 0.98" / 25 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 36,484 shp / 27,217 Kw = 33.71 kts
Range 6,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 287 tons

Complement: 137 - 179

Cost: £0.874 million / $3.497 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 25 tons, 1.4 %
Armour: 13 tons, 0.7 %
- Belts: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Armament: 9 tons, 0.5 %
- Armour Deck: 0 tons, 0.0 %
- Conning Tower: 3 tons, 0.2 %
Machinery: 892 tons, 49.7 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 575 tons, 32.1 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 224 tons, 12.5 %
Miscellaneous weights: 65 tons, 3.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 559 lbs / 253 Kg = 12.0 x 4.5 " / 115 mm shells or 0.3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.16
Metacentric height 1.4 ft / 0.4 m
Roll period: 12.6 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 73 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.36
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.05

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has rise forward of midbreak and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.410
Length to Beam Ratio: 10.00 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 21.69 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 67 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 69
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 25.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 3.28 ft / 1.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 21.33 ft / 6.50 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 19.69 ft / 6.00 m
- Mid (57 %): 18.86 ft / 5.75 m (10.66 ft / 3.25 m aft of break)
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 10.66 ft / 3.25 m
- Stern: 10.66 ft / 3.25 m
- Average freeboard: 15.78 ft / 4.81 m

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 175.7 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 122.9 %
Waterplane Area: 7,996 Square feet or 743 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 73 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 36 lbs/sq ft or 178 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.51
- Longitudinal: 2.31
- Overall: 0.60
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is cramped
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent
Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform

Breakdown of Miscellaneous weight:

Radar - 20 tons
Sonar - 20 tons
A/S outfit - four A/S mortars and two D/C racks - 25 tons

Level 3 Refit - 15%

Upgrade armament outfit - 115mm DP vice QF, modernize and expand 35mm battery, reduce 13.7mm machineguns (one retained on each bridge wing for local defense), reduce torpedo tubes
Add radar, add sonar
Remove mine rails and add A/S outfit
Provide armor protection for conning tower
Service life extension.

Cost: 235 tons

Time to execute: 48 days

Mindanao, Philippine Battlecruiser laid down 1935

Displacement: 25,654 t light; 26,791 t standard; 28,589 t normal; 30,027 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught

745.90 ft / 721.78 ft x 86.94 ft x 29.53 ft (normal load) [227.35 m / 220.00 m x 26.50 m x 9.00 m]

Armament:

9 - 11.02" / 280 mm guns (3x3 guns), 669.80lbs / 303.81kg shells, 1935 Model Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes) on centreline ends, majority forward, 1 raised mount - superfiring
16 - 4.53" / 115 mm guns (8x2 guns), 46.40lbs / 21.05kg shells, 1935 Model Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists on side, evenly spread
4 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns in single mounts, 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1935 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
32 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (16x2 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1935 Model Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts on side, evenly spread, 8 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 6,818 lbs / 3,092 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 145

Armour:

Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 11.8" / 300 mm 476.38 ft / 145.20 m 11.19 ft / 3.41 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 102 % of normal length

Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.97" / 50 mm 476.38 ft / 145.20 m 26.90 ft / 8.20 m

Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 11.8" / 300 mm 5.91" / 150 mm 11.8" / 300 mm
2nd: 1.97" / 50 mm 0.79" / 20 mm 1.97" / 50 mm
3rd: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.39" / 10 mm -
4th: 0.79" / 20 mm 0.39" / 10 mm -

Armour deck: 4.13" / 105 mm, Conning tower: 11.81" / 300 mm

Machinery:

Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 4 shafts, 165,229 shp / 123,261 Kw = 33.75 kts
Range 8,000nm at 15.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,236 tons

Complement: 1,099 - 1,429

Cost: £11.561 million / $46.244 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:

Armament: 852 tons, 3.0 %
Armour: 9,212 tons, 32.2 %
- Belts: 2,663 tons, 9.3 %
- Torpedo bulkhead: 933 tons, 3.3 %
- Armament: 1,923 tons, 6.7 %
- Armour Deck: 3,454 tons, 12.1 %
- Conning Tower: 238 tons, 0.8 %
Machinery: 4,694 tons, 16.4 %
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,716 tons, 37.5 %
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,935 tons, 10.3 %
Miscellaneous weights: 180 tons, 0.6 %

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:

Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 40,722 lbs / 18,471 Kg = 60.8 x 11.0 " / 280 mm shells or 5.6 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.11
Metacentric height 4.9 ft / 1.5 m
Roll period: 16.5 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.52
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.01

Hull form characteristics:

Hull has a flush deck and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.540
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.30 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 30.98 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 30.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 3.28 ft / 1.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 36.09 ft / 11.00 m
- Forecastle (20 %): 24.61 ft / 7.50 m
- Mid (50 %): 24.61 ft / 7.50 m
- Quarterdeck (15 %): 24.61 ft / 7.50 m
- Stern: 24.61 ft / 7.50 m
- Average freeboard: 25.52 ft / 7.78 m

Ship space, strength and comments:

Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100.8 %
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 192.6 %
Waterplane Area: 45,160 Square feet or 4,196 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 112 %
Structure weight / hull surface area: 158 lbs/sq ft or 770 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.95
- Longitudinal: 1.51
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Breakdown of Miscellaneous Weight

Surface search radar - 40 tons
Air search radars and directors - 50 tons
Reserved for future growth - 90 tons

Cost to refit: 1,283 tons

Time to execute: 52 days

All useful work, but the costs certainly add up.

Quoted

Originally posted by The Rock Doctor
All useful work, but the costs certainly add up.

Yes, they do. But it is a necessary evil. The hulls are still useful, and once refitted, the ships should serve for many more years.

As Built:

Date: 1940
Oceanic
Armament: 4x115mm guns
Elec HP: 4,000
Diesel HP: 12,000
Crew: 100
Weight of fuel & batteries 1000t
Misc weight: 60 tons
Light Displacement: 1,935 tons
Loaded Displacement 2,435 tons
Full Displacement: 3,016 tons
Reserve Buoyancy 19%
Max Surface Speed: 20.4 knots
Max Submerged Speed: 9.9 knots

Length: 95.0 m
Beam: 10.0 m
Draft: 6.4 m
Crush depth: 250 m
#TT 10 x 21" (10 reloads)
Tons Oil: 500.0 tons
Tons Battery: 500.0 tons

Surface Range 17,717@10 knots
Underwater range 240@4 knots


Proposed Refit:

Remove 115mm guns, turrets and superstructure
Add Snorkel - restructure pressure hull as necessary
Add/Improve Sonar
Add Radar

** Requires dock time for sonar upgrade - 15% of total

Projected cost to refit = 463 tons
Projected time to refit = 82 days
Projected time in dock = 13 days


As Refitted

Date: 1940
Oceanic
Armament:
Elec HP: 4,000
Diesel HP: 12,000
Crew: 100
Weight of fuel & batteries 1000t
Misc weight: 40 tons
Light Displacement: 1,849 tons
Loaded Displacement 2,359 tons
Full Displacement: 3,040 tons
Reserve Buoyancy 22%
Max Surface Speed: 20.4 knots
Max Submerged Speed: 9.9 knots

Length: 95.0 m
Beam: 10.0 m
Draft: 6.4 m
Crush depth: 250 m
#TT 10 x 21" (10 reloads)
Tons Oil: 500.0 tons
Tons Battery: 500.0 tons

Surface Range 17,717@10 knots
Underwater range 240@4 knots

All the guns and superstructure are going?

Quoted from "The Rock Doctor"

All the guns and superstructure are going?

The 115mm guns and their turrets, and the superstructure that supported them. A much reduced conning tower would remain.

Is there an AA gun or two, then?

When Perdy designed the original Mako, he cited a British submarine - I think it was the X-class - as his exemplar. From my understanding, the Mako has the same sort of setup with a turret forward of the sail and a turret aft, set on a bit of a fairwater to keep them further from spray when running surfaced. When I was talking with Bruce about the refit (I had made an offer to buy and refit them for Chile), I explained that I'd have removed the turrets and razed the fairwater structure. I think this is the "superstructure" that Bruce refers to.

My proposed refit would have retained a single wet-mount 100mm deck gun forward and some 1.1" AA on the rear of the sail; not sure what Bruce has in mind, since it doesn't appear any gun at all was retained. I myself would have retained at least one deck gun of substance, since the South China Sea probably has a lot of traffic carried in very small craft, against which a deck gun is still handy, and a torpedo is major overkill.

Rocky's questions are quite cogent, and Brock has done a far better job of explaining what I have in mind for the refit. I've sought to incorporate their comments into the revised scheme below, which I hopes better documents the intent.

Revised Scheme:

Remove 115mm gun turrets and fairwater
Fit single 115mm deck forward and one 25mm AA aft of conning tower
Add Snorkel - restructure pressure hull as necessary
Add/Improve Sonar
Add Radar

** Requires dock time for sonar upgrade - 15% of total

Projected cost to refit = 480 tons
Projected time to refit = 82 days
Projected time in dock = 13 days


Date: 1940
Oceanic
Armament: one 115mm and one 25mm AA
Elec HP: 4,000
Diesel HP: 12,000
Crew: 100
Weight of fuel & batteries 1000t
Misc weight: 42 tons
Light Displacement: 1,917 tons
Loaded Displacement 2,427 tons
Full Displacement: 3,040 tons
Reserve Buoyancy 20%
Max Surface Speed: 20.4 knots
Max Submerged Speed: 9.9 knots

Length: 95.0 m
Beam: 10.0 m
Draft: 6.4 m
Crush depth: 250 m
#TT 10 x 21" (10 reloads)
Tons Oil: 500.0 tons
Tons Battery: 500.0 tons

Surface Range 17,717@10 knots
Underwater range:240@4 knots

Thanks for the clarification. The refit seems like a pretty cost-effective one.

I myself have a submarine with 21cm guns aboard, and have been asking myself what I intend to do with it...

Quoted from "The Rock Doctor"

Thanks for the clarification. The refit seems like a pretty cost-effective one.

I myself have a submarine with 21cm guns aboard, and have been asking myself what I intend to do with it...

The I-30 design? That is a very good question. A barbette on a submarine? <shakes head>

I suppose that pulling the guns out and fitting a hangar for seaplanes might be possible, but I don't know if such fits with your tactical needs. In an event the refit is going to be expensive.

Offer her to the Mexicans cheap? :P

I would be more than happy to take her off your hands... :p Surcouf was always a favorite of mine.

Quoted from "The Rock Doctor"

I myself have a submarine with 21cm guns aboard, and have been asking myself what I intend to do with it...

Antisubmarine torpedo testing platform. Might as well get SOME sort of usefulness out of it.