WesWorld

The Arado Flugzeugwerke has announced preliminary details of the new transport design being developed to meet Luftwaffe requirements. It is a high-wing cantilever monoplane, with a central fuselage accommodating the flight deck and the main hold while the booms extending from the engine nacelles carry the large tail unit. The design will feature a tricycle undercarriage. Power will be supplied by two radial air-cooled engines of a new design now being developed by the Brandenburgische Motorenbau, each expected to generate up to 2,400 horsepower. Arado officials suggest that the design could carry up to forty-eight troops, thirty-six paratroops or 8,000 kilograms of cargo over distances of up to 2,000 kilometres.



It is expected that a prototype may fly sometime in the latter part of 1941.

Phew, for a minute I thought I'd see a centipede!

A much nicer looking and more practical transport, the Ar232 was the forerunner of the modern tactical airlifter and this brings us much closer. Remind me of the C-119 Flying Boxcar and the C-123 Provider

Noratlas probably?

Nice aircraft surely very usefull

I don't really see what's wrong with the historical Ar 232 that needs fixing.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral
A400Ms would be pretty useful as well.

I don't really see what's wrong with the historical Ar 232 that needs fixing.

I'd buy A400Ms if Bruce was making them. Chile needs a better airlifter than the Twin Condor...

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Originally posted by Brockpaine
Chile needs a better airlifter than the Twin Condor...

C-47/DC-3?

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral

A400Ms would be pretty useful as well.

I don't really see what's wrong with the historical Ar 232 that needs fixing.

I respect your opinion regarding the OTL aircraft but my opinion is different.

One could argue that the Savoia-Marchetti SM.82 is completely adequate and development of the Caproni Atlante I is superfluous. I am certain you would not agree in that case.

Quoted

Originally posted by BruceDuncan
One could argue that the Savoia-Marchetti SM.82 is completely adequate and development of the Caproni Atlante I is superfluous. I am certain you would not agree in that case.

Well for a start the SM.82 doesn't actually exist in WW, Italy being one of those countries which is rationalising rather than producing everything under the sun. Then there's the fact that the SM.82 isn't a passenger aircraft, unpressurised, short range, low speed etc.

So why is the WW Ar 232 different to the historical aircraft? What is driving the change? Your preamble mentions that the Luftwaffe wants a new transport aircraft, but why was that aircraft selected instead of others? It's interesting to know rather than things just materialising like a bowl of petunias.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral

Quoted

Originally posted by BruceDuncan
One could argue that the Savoia-Marchetti SM.82 is completely adequate and development of the Caproni Atlante I is superfluous. I am certain you would not agree in that case.

Well for a start the SM.82 doesn't actually exist in WW, Italy being one of those countries which is rationalising rather than producing everything under the sun. Then there's the fact that the SM.82 isn't a passenger aircraft, unpressurised, short range, low speed etc.

So why is the WW Ar 232 different to the historical aircraft? What is driving the change? Your preamble mentions that the Luftwaffe wants a new transport aircraft, but why was that aircraft selected instead of others? It's interesting to know rather than things just materialising like a bowl of petunias.

Since the SM.82 was offered in response to the recent Argentine air transport RFP I would think that the design exists - or your offer was bogus.

As to rationale why demand something of me that is not asked of others?

Just because something exists in the civilian market that just happened to get offered for military purposes doesn't mean that Italy is using the SM-82 for military purposes.....

Quoted

Originally posted by BruceDuncan
As to rationale why demand something of me that is not asked of others?

Rationale is asked of others as well. Are you really saying you don't want to go into any details of explaining decisions? Wesworld is a (very) alternate reality but things still happen for a reason.

Quoted

Originally posted by TexanCowboy
Just because something exists in the civilian market that just happened to get offered for military purposes doesn't mean that Italy is using the SM-82 for military purposes.....

There's a difference between "Well for a start the SM.82 doesn't actually exist in WW" and "The Savoia-Marchetti SM.82 would seem to nicely fit those specs" - followed immediately by a confirmation that the plane exists: "No, it really is the historical SM.82."

Presumably, there's some confusion on the part of the Italian player on the existence of the SM.82.

Quoted

Originally posted by Brockpaine
Presumably, there's some confusion on the part of the Italian player on the existence of the SM.82.

Or just think, maybe it's an aircraft that hasn't been produced years ahead of it's historical date? Why does Italy need to buy SM.82s when they have quite a few SM.75s, 81s, and more importantly, Piaggio P.50T transport aircraft? That doesn't stop the Savoia-Marchetti design office from producing designs. If there's a chance they can sell it to someone else, I'm sure they will.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral

Quoted

Originally posted by Brockpaine
Presumably, there's some confusion on the part of the Italian player on the existence of the SM.82.

Or just think, maybe it's an aircraft that hasn't been produced years ahead of it's historical date?

You mean like the Fiat G.55, the Macchi C.200, and a host of other Italian aircraft? Wow, what a novel change of tradition.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral
That doesn't stop the Savoia-Marchetti design office from producing designs. If there's a chance they can sell it to someone else, I'm sure they will.

Presumably, that might affect Savoia-Marchetti's capability of sending an SM.82 to Argentina for demonstrations. There was no comment there about it being an unbuilt paper design, so I presumed it was in service - or at least there were flight-capable versions able to be tested.

Even now, I can't really tell from your comments if the SM.82 exists or not, and what stage of existence it is actually in; perhaps you could clarify?

Quoted

Originally posted by Brockpaine
Even now, I can't really tell from your comments if the SM.82 exists or not, and what stage of existence it is actually in; perhaps you could clarify?

A prototype would be built for the Argentine competition. It shouldn't that difficult to build a one-off, or start production, given the commonality with the SM.75. The SM.82 is essentially an SM.75 with a deeper fuselage for better transport capacity, and militarised. The SM.82 would make a good addition to the SM.75s currently operated in Argentina.

Quoted

Originally posted by Red Admiral
A prototype would be built for the Argentine competition. It shouldn't that difficult to build a one-off, or start production, given the commonality with the SM.75. The SM.82 is essentially an SM.75 with a deeper fuselage for better transport capacity, and militarised. The SM.82 would make a good addition to the SM.75s currently operated in Argentina.

Thank you, that does clarify things.

A question back on the historical Ar 232 design;

Does anyone know whether all the mini wheels retract into the fuselage? The main wheels seem to retract into the wings and the nosewheel rotates backwards into a semi-conformal position. I can't find any details on the little load spreading wheels though.

AFAIK they do not retract at sll...

I agree, I think the little wheels don't retract.

The undercarriage was wacky but the basic design has been copied time and again, the Herk owes something to the Ar232.

I can see why Bruce has gone for a clean sheet approach, as he as with other aircraft. It's refreshing IMHO, at least Germany won't turn out like the whole series of Luft 46 Secret Project books. It seems a basis could be made from the Ju-252 ramp etc, taking it a step further you could come up with this.