WesWorld

The idea of the Raj is to put 410mm guns on the cheap. The main engagements are for the 40000 tons BB. Ship will not be in the main battleline. That is the mission of the three older BB, the new Akbar, whatever the SAE sent if we are attacked and whatever the British decide to sent to help.

Hrolf got the main idea in regard to expected engagements. Is not the first all forward design. the Samanjir is.

Sorry, how does India get into a war that involves Britain AND the SAE?

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
Sorry, how does India get into a war that involves Britain AND the SAE?

By being attacked by a third party. Both SAINT and ABUSE state in case of either party being attacked by a third party the other party will help.

Fairly tricky though if the third party is the Dutch or the Australians. The SAE would have to ditch SANTA or the British would have to egnore their commonwealth ties.

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
Fairly tricky though if the third party is the Dutch or the Australians. The SAE would have to ditch SANTA or the British would have to egnore their commonwealth ties.

True. But if India is the one being attacked it spells it out very plainly in the SAINT agreement. That was one of the reasons of the SAE being an intermediary in the ABUSE talks, to try to ease the fears of them having to fight the Dutch. Still you have to trust people sometimes.

And that remind me that need to talk to the British again.

The way I see it ABUSE only apply's if India is attacked in the Persian gulf?

*looks at treaty*

Hmmm appears that is not the case.

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
The way I see it ABUSE only apply's if India is attacked in the Persian gulf?

Not the way I see it. That's why need to spell it out with the British. The way I understand it is everywhere.

You're too fast.

Have you left SATSUMA yet for that treaty to be in force (military part)?

Quoted

Originally posted by Vukovlad
Have you left SATSUMA yet for that treaty to be in force (military part)?

Need to check my archives but I think it was in August 1938.

The way you see it or the way you hope it is?

Not sure whats in the Brits interest to protect the Bharat outside the Persian gulf.

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
The way you see it or the way you hope it is?

Not sure whats in the Brits interest to protect the Bharat outside the Persian gulf.

I dont really care but dont see how else to interpret this: "§13 The Empire of Bharat will leave Satsuma at the earliest possible time allowed by the Charter of the Satsuma Agreement,with this current entente not being declared binding until such time as above indicated occur "

EDIT: Since P99´s post appeared inbetween I am unsure if the qoute was dircted at me

True. is not binding till 1st February 1939 when we leave Satsuma.

I have two words for you...

Perfidious Albion

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
The way you see it or the way you hope it is?

Not sure whats in the Brits interest to protect the Bharat outside the Persian gulf.

That if Bharat falls their position in the Persian Gulf goes to hell perhaps?

That is the reason need to talk to British, to spell it out.

Quoted

Originally posted by thesmilingassassin
Not sure whats in the Brits interest to protect the Bharat outside the Persian gulf.

The way I see it, everything India owns is stuff India can reasonably defend against most single opponents. Against any of the Big Five Alliances (FAR, AEGIS, NATO, SATSUMA, and SAER) then India can still make a pretty good show defending their borders and outer territories.

ABUSE and SAINT, for India, mean that the two other naval powers of the Indian Ocean have come to a peaceful entente. To me, India's triumph in those two treaties was not in acquiring allies, but in eliminating potential enemies.

Well said. India now haves an Empire that extends from the Red Sea to the border of Burma through their puppet nations and the Empire perse. India is satisfied with the new status-quo. Even the latest Persian agreements are a sign that India wants a more stable Middle East. Getting two of largest fleets in the World to at least cooperate with you is better that having to stare at their gun barrels.

Quoted

Originally posted by perdedor99
The idea of the Raj is to put 410mm guns on the cheap. The main engagements are for the 40000 tons BB. Ship will not be in the main battleline.

I don't think India will have much of a choice of what ship will go into a battleline or not. With so few ships, there's little room for a detailed plan, it'll just be what happens to be available (or hasn't been sunk).

For the difference in tonnage it makes far more sense to build another Akbar V and get more capability along with some commonality.

Rajaram I is a dangerous ship. It's layout is odd, it could be easy to take adavantage of the all-forward layout. Speed is good, belt armour not so good but the deck armour is and those 16in guns force an enemy to fight from distance so the deck armour works in the favour of the Rajaram.

Not sure I'd build it myself but it is a powerful BC. It's no G3 though. Even the St. Vincents wouldn't sweat too much but Rajaram can dish out punishment and those main guns need watching.

Another modification of the Villar design as the Samanjir I. This time similar layout as the Villar but with six 350mm main guns instead of eight 305mm.

OOC: Still trying to figureout what to built in 1942 concurrently with the Akbar V.

Kolkota, India Large Cruiser laid down 1942

Displacement:
23,030 t light; 24,052 t standard; 25,944 t normal; 27,457 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
741.73 ft / 721.78 ft x 82.02 ft x 27.89 ft (normal load)
226.08 m / 220.00 m x 25.00 m x 8.50 m

Armament:
6 - 13.78" / 350 mm guns (2x3 guns), 1,308.20lbs / 593.39kg shells, 1942 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
8 - 4.92" / 125 mm guns (4x2 guns), 59.59lbs / 27.03kg shells, 1942 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts - superfiring
8 - 4.92" / 125 mm guns (4x2 guns), 59.59lbs / 27.03kg shells, 1942 Model
Dual purpose guns in deck mounts with hoists
on side, evenly spread
20 - 1.38" / 35.0 mm guns (10x2 guns), 1.31lbs / 0.59kg shells, 1942 Model
Anti-aircraft guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, 6 raised mounts
24 - 0.59" / 15.0 mm guns (6x4 guns), 0.10lbs / 0.05kg shells, 1942 Model
Machine guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, 2 raised mounts
Weight of broadside 8,831 lbs / 4,006 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 100

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 11.8" / 300 mm 472.44 ft / 144.00 m 10.86 ft / 3.31 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 101% of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
1.57" / 40 mm 472.44 ft / 144.00 m 25.59 ft / 7.80 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 13.8" / 350 mm 7.87" / 200 mm 11.8" / 300 mm
2nd: 1.18" / 30 mm 0.79" / 20 mm 1.18" / 30 mm
3rd: 1.18" / 30 mm 0.79" / 20 mm 1.18" / 30 mm
4th: 0.79" / 20 mm - -
5th: 0.39" / 10 mm - -

- Armour deck: 3.94" / 100 mm, Conning tower: 13.78" / 350 mm

Machinery:
Oil fired boilers, steam turbines,
Geared drive, 4 shafts, 127,343 shp / 94,998 Kw = 32.03 kts
Range 15,000nm at 12.00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 3,405 tons

Complement:
1,021 - 1,328

Cost:
£13.260 million / $53.041 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 1,104 tons, 4.3%
Armour: 8,180 tons, 31.5%
- Belts: 2,555 tons, 9.8%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 704 tons, 2.7%
- Armament: 1,528 tons, 5.9%
- Armour Deck: 3,133 tons, 12.1%
- Conning Tower: 260 tons, 1.0%
Machinery: 3,405 tons, 13.1%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 10,192 tons, 39.3%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2,913 tons, 11.2%
Miscellaneous weights: 150 tons, 0.6%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
36,436 lbs / 16,527 Kg = 27.9 x 13.8 " / 350 mm shells or 5.1 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1.13
Metacentric height 4.7 ft / 1.4 m
Roll period: 15.9 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 50 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0.64
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1.02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has a flush deck
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0.550
Length to Beam Ratio: 8.80 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 30.79 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 55 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 49
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 30.00 degrees
Stern overhang: 3.28 ft / 1.00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 28.87 ft / 8.80 m
- Forecastle (20%): 21.16 ft / 6.45 m
- Mid (50%): 21.16 ft / 6.45 m
- Quarterdeck (15%): 21.16 ft / 6.45 m
- Stern: 21.16 ft / 6.45 m
- Average freeboard: 21.78 ft / 6.64 m
Ship tends to be wet forward

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100.1%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 169.8%
Waterplane Area: 43,014 Square feet or 3,996 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 162 lbs/sq ft or 789 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0.97
- Longitudinal: 1.31
- Overall: 1.00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Too few main guns for the size of ship, I'd say. I'd prefer having enough 12" guns to too few 14".